A question I am sure I will get Flamed for...

[WarMike]

hello all,

I am just going to ask the question:

How much would it cost for a good writer(no big name) to write a RPG based on my World and ideas in D20(can you even do that?) or some other system? Maybe a 144 page book.

Here is why I am asking this. I am a businessman. I sell things for a living. I am very creative in selling and running a business and I have some good ideas, I just can't write. I hate to type, but if you you need to sell something, I am your man.

I want to have a very small RPG Company. Right now, I am working on another project and that is moving along great. I just wanted to ask the question as far as an RPG.

Try not to flame me too bad.

Warmike

[Winneganfake]

hello all,

I am just going to ask the question:

How much would it cost for a good writer(no big name) to write a RPG based on my World and ideas in D20? Maybe a 144 page book.

Here is why I am asking this. I am a businessman. I sell things for a living. I am very creative in selling and running a business and I have some good ideas, I just can't write. I hate to type, but if you you need to sell something, I am your man.


Damn.

Wow.

I'm almost tempted to say, "bankroll the project I'm on now, and I'd do it for you," But no.

You'd basically be working as a producer, and giving the freelancer you hire ALL the creation work (I'm not talking the general concept, just all the supporting detail).

Probably 90% net royalties after you recoup your investment on printing, layout, art.

[Aeonite]

Good writer = .03 / word
Let's guess 500 words/page
You said 144 pages.

144 x 500 x .03 = $2,160 for writing.

More if layout, editing, etc. involved.

Start around there if you really want a good writer. I've worked for less on larger projects, but only when I was starting out.

[Frank Sronce]

If you wanted to get flamed, you should have asked how you can get someone to write it for free. :D

[Snowblind]

3 cents per word is what beginning writers get paid, surely?

I mean, it's only up from there.

[Aeonite]

Do you think the adventure gaming industry tends to burn out talented writers simply because of how it functions? John Tynes has expressed similar sentiments to what you've said here.

I think there's a case to be made for that, but I'm not sure I'm an example of it. In my case, I found I was writing less and less because the demands of the company were sucking my time. On the other hand, if you're going to make a living as a writer in the games industry, you either have to pick and choose your employers very carefully, or you have to be amazingly prolific. I mean, a good per-word rate in the games business is 4-5 cents a word. When I trained as a journalist, they told us not to get out of bed for less than 20 cents a word, because it simply wasn't worth your time. And that was more than ten years ago.

--James Wallis, Director of Hogshead Publishing, the company behind Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, Nobilis, and the popular New Style RPGs

http://www.ogrecave.com/interviews/jameswallis2.shtml

[Aeonite]

Google search:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=rpg+writer+cents+per+word&btnG=Search

Range is generally 1 cent to 5 cents. Newer writers at the low end, more experienced writers at the high end. Split the difference for most decent writers and you get 3 cents.

It's pretty to think RPG writers get paid more, but they generally don't. In fact, most writers (90-95%) don't make enough money to live on, and support themselves with full time jobs in another industry.

[domino]

I'm a good writer. I'd do it for $0.03/w + a measure of royalties, I think.

After serious discussion with the prospective boss. If he doesn't have as clear an image of the world as he thinks, it's going to mean real trouble down the line.

Oh, yeah. And advance.

[Ineti]

Ideas are a dime a dozen. Executing those ideas into something interesting takes skill. Sounds like that good writer might want to consider adding a development fee of some sort to the kitty, either a one-time flat fee or a slight increase in the word rate. :)

And I'd push for at least part of the payment upon delivery of the writing, as opposed to it coming on publication.

But that may just be me.

[pawsplay]

Probably around $5000, with a 40% advance.

Working from someone else's ideas is great if you love the ideas. Without actually knowing what those ideas are, my inclination is to believe the ideas suck. In any case, it's likely to strongly resemble work more than the average freelance project.

[Snowblind]

It's pretty to think RPG writers get paid more, but they generally don't. In fact, most writers (90-95%) don't make enough money to live on, and support themselves with full time jobs in another industry.

I know. I am one. That's why I was so surprised to hear that any of 'em get paid *less* than 3 cents per word. Prestige, coolness, fun or otherwise, unless I absolutely adored the game line, I'd not work for less than that.

[Embra]

Based only on my own humble experience, pay for the written word in the UK is generally better than in the US. When I started out, the better part of a decade ago, I was getting 8p to 10p per word for relatively trivial stuff in magazines. Compare that to the 5 cents a word that established writers I know working for significant US magazines get even now. It's not an easy task making a living from words... :(

[lifespeed]

Based only on my own humble experience, pay for the written word in the UK is generally better than in the US. When I started out, the better part of a decade ago, I was getting 8p to 10p per word for relatively trivial stuff in magazines. Compare that to the 5 cents a word that established writers I know working for significant US magazines get even now. It's not an easy task making a living from words... :(

Hey Embra, thanks for pointing out yet another reason I'm living in the wrong country. That's pretty much the kind of money Aeonite's jouranlist buddies were talking about.

Speaking of which, I think those journalist buddies were pretty much whacked out of their gourd. I don't think anybody in America would get a $0.20 word rate for creative stuff, maybe for hack journalism, but not for fiction and assuredly not RPG work.

No offense to any journalists, I just pretty much hate American journalism, it's pretty much 3rd grade reading level hack work in my opinion. But then, that could be the tendency of American "news" agencies to talk more about puppies and wieght loss then things that actually matter.

[Embra]

Ooooooh, Lifespeed! You're heading into the complex territory of 'Do the audience define the writing and content quality, or does the writing dictate what the audience wants?' ;)

The written word, along with many forms of creativity (save creative accountancy), is becomming increasingly devalued by the population at large. Witness the sad depths to which television, film and the media in general continues to sink. Every now and then something like West Wing, Waking The Dead, or even 24 comes along and everyone acts surprised when good story telling proves its worth.

>Is dragged off grumbling<

[VampireHamster]

I think the producers of some of these shows are seeing if they can get away with showing untalented people doing totally stupid things and still get an audience. Why pay real actors anything if you can sell junk?

Don't be a tv drone. Turn it off and get the entertainment that you really want.



V Hamster

[ChefKyle]

So, WarMike, you've got the price list - gonna spring the cash for the project? Or did you faint when you got the quote?;)

What's the plan?

[FraserRonald]

Speaking of which, I think those journalist buddies were pretty much whacked out of their gourd. I don't think anybody in America would get a $0.20 word rate for creative stuff, maybe for hack journalism, but not for fiction and assuredly not RPG work.

As for per word rate, likely you will never see that for RPG work, but there are venues that have $0.20 US + rates. Cicada pays $0.25 per word and SCIFICTION pays $0.20. Playboy pays up to $1.00 per word! The venues are out there, it's just getting your work accepted in those venues that's the problem. For most--like Playboy--until you amass a body of work and name recognition, you've got almost no chance of breaking. I say "almost no chance" because for the right story, there's always a chance.

Take care all.