WotC Dreamblade Miniatures Game

[mcrow]

Does this game sound like it is going to flop as bad as I think it is?

Another chess rip-off fantasy game that is collectible. When wil people learn that these games wont sell?

we have already two local retailers say the will not be carrying this game and it is the first time they will decline trying out a WotC game.

hopefully when this one hits bottom it doesn't drag D&D with it. :(

[oni no won]

If the price is anything like that other collectible fantasy chess like game (can't remember the name at the moment...), it definately won't survive.

At Wizard World, I was impressed with the gameplay but the miniatures themselves turned me off to the game. Many of the demo miniatures didn't catch my fancy and the huge square base made the minaitures even worse.

[regardless]

As a Magic player, I'm actually kind of intrigued by Dreamblade even though I've never been interested by any collectable miniatures game before, so they must be doing something right. I played the demo on their site and I just like the way it plays, the strategy of it... seems like they have the old 'easy to learn but hard to master' thing down pat.

The theme is kind of daft though, I mean... Dreamblade? My eleven year old brother cringed at that one. I must stress I know nothing of other miniatures games, maybe they're ripping them off or whatever. Reading the Hetacomb forums i don't have any illusions about WOTC supporting the game beyond any teething problems :rolleyes:

Assuming I'm still interested when/if it comes out in the UK I'll buy just enough to get by. Treat it more like a boardgame than anything collectable that I'd feel compelled to follow with my wallet.

[TygerTyger]

hopefully when this one hits bottom it doesn't drag D&D with it. :(
Hello, fearmongering! Remember Hecatomb? It died a quick and painful death, and Magic seems to be doing just fine. Why would the fate of D&D, in any form, hang upon Dreamblade's success or failure?

[BlakeT]

As a Magic player, I'm actually kind of intrigued by Dreamblade even though I've never been interested by any collectable miniatures game before, so they must be doing something right.

You're a perfect example of what the owner of my FLGS said to me today. His exact words were (as best as I can reconstruct), "They're not marketing it to you, but to new comers to the miniature game thing like Magic players, etc."

The game isn't targeting people like me, who play D&D, D&D minis and also other mini games (Warmachine/Hordes atm), but newcomers and those also that enjoy the tourney scene. If I recall correctly Wizards is already backing this game with some big money tourneys, that'll pull in the serious player crowd as well.

To be honest, I'd love to get into it, but with the new RPG stuff coming out (god you don't want to know what I spent at Origins and today) and the D&D mini new set out, plus the two dragons coming out, I just can't do another new game.

Though, I say that and yet I still plan on buying a booster case and starter of Horrorclix. It'll be my first shot at playing a 'clix game. I already have Cthulu here next to my desk.

[Antonidas]

My first impression of this was "Wait, they gave Dementists* their own game? What the hell?" and everything since then has only strengthened that assumption.



*Dementists were people from Magic: The Gathering that belonged to the Cabal, which was a bit of a cross between standard black magic bad guys, Haliburton, and the mafia. The Dementists were gladiator showboats that drugged themselves up and then used magic to make their drug induced nightmare monsters real.

[mcrow]

Hello, fearmongering! Remember Hecatomb? It died a quick and painful death, and Magic seems to be doing just fine. Why would the fate of D&D, in any form, hang upon Dreamblade's success or failure?

Well, if you knew how much overhead there is to produce a collectible miniatures game, I think would be a bit more worried. Hecatomb was a big failure, but the overhead on that game likely wasn't even a third of what Dreamblade will have. Not to mention Hasbro will only tolerate so many failures and lost money before they start thinging about giving WotC that axe.

With D20(including D&D & SW minis) and MTG being their two money makers they also have had a bunch of failed CCGs.

[Ragnarok_Engine]

Huh. I don't know if it'll sell well, but from all the information and the started set available on the website, I'm pretty excited about Dreamblade. The theme (powerful psychics battling over a section of the Collective Unconscious with psychic constructs) seems fairly original and evocative to me, and the rules bear out the theme reasonably well. The rules also seem to be a good mix of strategy and dice-luck, so will hold my interest for a while.

I'll probably pick up enough for several friends to play, and see how much interest I can drum up. I get most of my collectible stuff from a bulk retailer, so I don't have to worry about locat store availability. It's going to be a much smaller set than SWM or D&DM, so it won't generate the sheer buying frenzy, but I'd think WOTC will be anticipating that. Ditto with the lack of an established license. WOTC seems to be pretty serious about drumming up support for it, though. I know Robin Laws just finished writing a contracted Dreamblade novel.

[Pointycat]

I like the idea of the game, and I like what they've shown of it so far, but after the meteoric rise and fall of Hecatomb I'm not about to invest cash in another unproven WoTC product. It's just hard to get excited about another property that will probably be dumped as soon as it hits stores.

[TygerTyger]

Well, if you knew how much overhead there is to produce a collectible miniatures game, I think would be a bit more worried. Hecatomb was a big failure, but the overhead on that game likely wasn't even a third of what Dreamblade will have. Not to mention Hasbro will only tolerate so many failures and lost money before they start thinging about giving WotC that axe.

With D20(including D&D & SW minis) and MTG being their two money makers they also have had a bunch of failed CCGs.
Ah, so my position is based in ignorance? Thank you ever so much for informing me of that. :rolleyes:

I know what WotC's track record has been like. I just don't see any reason to go from that to "zOMG Dreamblade = teh doomzorz for Wizards!" If none of the past failed games have spelled the death of the company, I don't think taking a chance with a new product will either.

[Nate X]

I don't think taking a chance with a new product will either.

Not to mention that people have been certain that Hasbro was going to shutter Wizards since they bought them awhile back now.

Personally, I think the idea of the game is a good one. It plays decently and it overcomes the my big problem of having to put together and paint minis (which I personally suck at...please don't ask to see my horribly mutilated skaven...). It's also collectible, so if it sticks, its a constant revenue generator because people must have them all! And if it doesn't? Melt down the plastic and use it to make more D&D minis :D

I don't think we have to worry about Wizards dying any time soon. It certainly won't be Dreamblades potential failure that kills the mighty WotC.

[Craig Oxbrow]

I hadn't noticed that the ads on the backs of US comics were referring to a CMG until I saw this thread and read the small print - I figured it was a videogame.

The figures seem largely nice, in a 'ramped up the surrealism compared to D&D' way. What scale are they?

[javelin98]

This just looks terrible. At least some of the other CMG's have appeal for using the minis outside the system, but this one... oy. That's all, just "oy".

[BlakeT]

The figures seem largely nice, in a 'ramped up the surrealism compared to D&D' way. What scale are they?

I'd say 28mm? We noticed at the local FLGS that if you carefully seperate the black base of the figure away from the big huge base, that has all the stats and rules on it, they fit nicely on the traditional D&D square mat. =)

So they do have a potential alternate use, if the set does die or if you want to use them for gaming.

[mcrow]

Ah, so my position is based in ignorance? Thank you ever so much for informing me of that. :rolleyes:[/qoute]

Sorry, that is not really what I meant. It takes a huge investment to produce a CMG. As big as WoTC is in the gaming indurstry, a game that costs so much to produce and develop would have a big effect on their bottom line.

I know what WotC's track record has been like. I just don't see any reason to go from that to "zOMG Dreamblade = teh doomzorz for Wizards!" If none of the past failed games have spelled the death of the company, I don't think taking a chance with a new product will either.

As others have posted Hasbro isn't really to fond of WotC anyway. IIRC the last numbers that they released had WotC posting the lowest profit margins of any of the companies divisions. When you are talking about large companies like Hasbro divisions that performs (financially)weak might be seen as a liability.

Now Dreamblade all by it's self wouldn't sink WotC but since D&D and MTG are on a down swing along with other games that failed Dreamblade may be the last straw.

I think the game is probly fun, but the fact that it is collectible will be turn-off for the strategy game types and the fact that you are playing game with a fixed board will turn-off people who like CMGs. Not to mention that the minis don't have a dual purpose like D&D minis do.

So, in the end I never said that this would be the end of WotC I just this *could* be another nail in the coffin. We don't know how many WotC has left.

Crap, I hope it does take off and I'm very wrong. I don't want to see WotC go anywhere. Since they got into the gaming industry they have been the steadying influence. The gaming industry would be very much different (IMO) without them

[tetsujin28]

The sky is falling! The sky is falling!

[Falke]

A guy I know got flown out to WOTC for a weekend to get a sneak peek at the game a couple of weeks ago.

He'll be running a couple of tournaments in the Madison, WI area when the game comes out. I plan on playing in at least one of them just for fun.

[Korr]

Personally, I don't understand why WotC needs to have another fantasy CMG. Why couldn't they have gone with another genre?

[J. H. Frank]

Do D&D and SW minis have cash tournies? Because Dreamblade does.

Gamers, at least the ones in my area, will follow the money. I'm not an expert, but this strategy seems to have worked for Vs. System as well.

[Mr. Horrible]

The first I heard about Dreamblade was on Robin D. Laws' blog (http://robin-d-laws.livejournal.com/152526.html).

I'm a long-time Laws fan, so anything that he's involved in - tangentially in this case - gets at least a look.

-Horrible

[Thomas T]

Personally, I don't understand why WotC needs to have another fantasy CMG. Why couldn't they have gone with another genre?
Well, they already have a historical (axis and allies) and sci fi (star wars) lines on top of their main fantasy line. So that's the main bases already covered. And Dreamblade is only really fantasy in the sense of "stuff that isn't real". There's a lot of modern-day and horrorish stuff in there too.

[Craig Oxbrow]

Well, they already have a historical (axis and allies) and sci fi (star wars) lines on top of their main fantasy line. So that's the main bases already covered. And Dreamblade is only really fantasy in the sense of "stuff that isn't real". There's a lot of modern-day and horrorish stuff in there too.
The miniatures don't let on there - they look pretty fantasy. Even the token human has a wizardy robe and a funky-looking melee weapon.

[Ragnarok_Engine]

The miniatures don't let on there - they look pretty fantasy. Even the token human has a wizardy robe and a funky-looking melee weapon.

Not all of them. In the PDF version of the starter set, there's a figure called "Possessed Gunman" or something similar. Essentially a hitman who's been taken over by the spirits of his guns. Very modern/horror looking figure. Also see "Asylum Escapee".

[J. H. Frank]

The Knight of Tomorrow is wearing power armor.

[Korr]

Either way, it seems like a rehash of several already done genres. Why not an "old west" type CMG that uses the d20 minis rules? I would have dropped a crapton of money on that. As it is, Dreamblade seems like the same old thing with a new rules set that I don't feel like learning.

But that is, of course, just my opinion. I hope it does well, as that can only be a good thing for the gaming industry. I, for one, ain't touchin' this one.

[Ragnarok_Engine]

Either way, it seems like a rehash of several already done genres. Why not an "old west" type CMG that uses the d20 minis rules? I would have dropped a crapton of money on that. As it is, Dreamblade seems like the same old thing with a new rules set that I don't feel like learning.

But that is, of course, just my opinion. I hope it does well, as that can only be a good thing for the gaming industry. I, for one, ain't touchin' this one.

While I respect that this game doesn't sound like the sort of thing you'd enjoy, I'm not sure I can see how it's "the same old thing". Rather than being a typical wargame, it's a board-based territory control game sort of like chess crossed with king-of-the-hill, but with force construction. The only game anywhere near this one I can think of was the Japanese import Navia Drapt, which didn't get much play (as far as I'm aware) because of the exorbitant import price-gouging.

[Korr]

I meant more from a genre standpoint than system. If it's truly a unique system, that's great, but I would have preferred a more unique genre than what they went with. The setting doesn't strike me as anything truly different than anything we've seen before. I'm already playing a fantasy CMG, and I'm already planning on playing another horror CMG (HorrorClix), and while it may be a new system, the setting isn't different enough to sway me from any of the other games I'm playing right now. That's all I'm saying.

[mcrow]

The only game anywhere near this one I can think of was the Japanese import Navia Drapt, which didn't get much play (as far as I'm aware) because of the exorbitant import price-gouging.

Navia Drapt failed because of the collectibel nature of the game. Or so out local retailers said. People just didn't want to play pseudo chess game that was collectible and while Dreamblade is even farther away from chess than Navia Drapt it is still collectible.

Of course who knows maybe Collectible Board Games will sweep the gaming industry and be the next money maker.:confused:

[Thomas T]

I meant more from a genre standpoint than system.
OK, I think you've lost me. Let's start again: What genre do you think dreamblade is? Because I can't think of anything similar, except <i>sort of</i> Hecatomb. I suspect you may have an excessively broad definition of fantasy here. But... well, tell me if I'm barking up the wrong tree.

[Korr]

OK, I think you've lost me. Let's start again: What genre do you think dreamblade is? Because I can't think of anything similar, except <i>sort of</i> Hecatomb. I suspect you may have an excessively broad definition of fantasy here. But... well, tell me if I'm barking up the wrong tree.
My FLGS received a bunch of demo pieces. Every piece I saw looks like it could just as easily fit into D&D minis. I saw bizarre insectlike creatures, demonic looking humanoids in plate armor with flaming swords, robe draped wizard looking guys, etc. In short, it looked like your average fantasy stuff.

[Thomas T]

My FLGS received a bunch of demo pieces. Every piece I saw looks like it could just as easily fit into D&D minis.
Fair enough. The online previews show a bit more variety - example 1 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dbm/article/20060623a) - example 2 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dbm/article/20060614a).