My hate of d02 know no limit.

[A silent wail]

It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game.

Frist off it is way to liniar.You just get better in everyway.THere is no way in avoiding it.I mena no mater what you are, you have have hit points and levels.

It is over comlicated,and simplist at the same time. IT is harder to hit a mmman in plate armor.And hammers and swords tear chaim mail the same way. Then you have the detail of when you can atack,and what range weapons have,and how far you can move.

Classes, are jokes. really.From how hits points.skill points,and bonus powers are moved about. In the end in boils down to this.

levle systems do not work.They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter or even mag doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabed. Also with the way hit points work, your either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold.Nothing in the middle.

the flaw of rolling a d20 is also that the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time.ALso so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use.We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow.Also if your good with guns, you must know how to use a sword.


In the end, d20 is too many rules, and not enough rules at the same time.Has too many strick rules, while leaving many feild wide open with no reason. I am ranting here,and know this dosen't make much sense to many people.BUt in the end I would like to see one come with a good reason d20 is a good system.

[braincraft]

I hate D02 as well. Why even bother buying dice when you could just flip a coin?

[ReverendTom]

can I just mention..."Wow"



I think I need to retake all my english classes over again to undo the damage that this post has caused.

[Grok]

Thank you for registering...

[sys64738]

I AM HAT TEH D02 TO! KIL IT OT DETH.

[Corporate Dog]

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you Funksaw's retarded little brother!!!!

Regards,
Corporate Dog

[Sparrow Thirteen]

Originally posted by sys64738
I AM HAT TEH D02 TO! KIL IT OT DETH.


ur all loosers

d5O is t3h 133+

[Gravity's Angel]

As much as it pains me, because of the horrendous English and the potential flame bait, this has got to go in Open.

[Zamiel]

Originally posted by A silent wail
It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game.

Frist off it is way to liniar.You just get better in everyway.THere is no way in avoiding it.I mena no mater what you are, you have have hit points and levels.

It is over comlicated,and simplist at the same time. IT is harder to hit a mmman in plate armor.And hammers and swords tear chaim mail the same way. Then you have the detail of when you can atack,and what range weapons have,and how far you can move.

Classes, are jokes. really.From how hits points.skill points,and bonus powers are moved about. In the end in boils down to this.

levle systems do not work.They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter or even mag doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabed. Also with the way hit points work, your either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold.Nothing in the middle.

the flaw of rolling a d20 is also that the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time.ALso so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use.We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow.Also if your good with guns, you must know how to use a sword.


In the end, d20 is too many rules, and not enough rules at the same time.Has too many strick rules, while leaving many feild wide open with no reason. I am ranting here,and know this dosen't make much sense to many people.BUt in the end I would like to see one come with a good reason d20 is a good system.
Classic...I give it a 7 on the trollometer. Next time, more subtlety on teh spellig errars.
-Zam

[Cthulhu-chan]

Originally posted by braincraft
I hate D02 as well. Why even bother buying dice when you could just flip a coin?

This post should have been mine. Curse you, Braincraft!

-Must remain alert CC

[Thalantos]

Originally posted by braincraft
I hate D02 as well. Why even bother buying dice when you could just flip a coin?


Well, if ya notice the title of the thread, it appears he is talking about the d02 system, which I suppose you could use flippig a coin, but it would have to be a really dirty, grungy coin, that, when cleaned off, would just be a rcappy regular one from 1997 that isn't even worth anything.
Man, those game designers! How dare they design such a simple system! It's so flawed, I don't know what to do!
Except suggest the original poster take up remedial English.

[braincraft]

Originally posted by Cthulhu-chan


This post should have been mine. Curse you, Braincraft!

-Must remain alert CC

I could always delete it and and let you take it.


But that would be cheating, and ultimately, unsatisfying.

[SteveD]

It's like a kung-fu thread!

"My hate of d02 know no limit! You have bad honour against me! My now kill at you!"

I submit that, from now on, "my hate d02 know no limit" be the RPGNet equivalent of All your base.

:D

Steve

[NPC Artiste]

Wow. That's a work of serious goofball-troll art, man.

The next time some dingleberry asks me "is gaming art?" I'm going to show them this thread.

Pardon me. I need to read it again, with fresh underwear.

[SteveD]

And Thantalos misses the joke!

But we have these lovely parting gifts for you...

[NYTFLYR]

Originally posted by Corporate Dog
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you Funksaw's retarded little brother!!!!

Regards,
Corporate Dog

Damn you, you made laugh till I cried!

[Miranda]

In the interest of preserving my proofreading skills, and as an intellectual exercise, I now present:

THE NEW AND IMPROVED D20 POST!

Caution: Even with the typos gone, it still don't make sense. ;)

Originally posted by A silent wail
It fails in just about every aspect of a game, and it is more of a rule playing game than a role playing game.

First off, it is way too linear. You just get better in every way. There is no way to avoid it. I mean, no matter what you are, you have hit points and levels.

It is over-complicated and simplistic at the same time. It is harder to hit a man in plate armor. Hammers and swords tear chain mail the same way. Then you have the details of when you can attack, and what range weapons have, and how far you can move.

Classes are jokes, really. From how hits points, skill points, and bonus powers are moved about, in the end it boils down to this:

Level systems do not work. They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter, or even mage, doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabbed. Also, with the way hit points work, you're either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold. Nothing in the middle.

The flaw of rolling a d20 is that the best fighter in the world, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time. Also, so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use? We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow. Also, if you're good with guns, you must know how to use a sword.

In the end, d20 has too many rules and not enough rules at the same time. It has too many strict rules, while leaving many fields wide open with no reason. I am ranting here, and know this doesn't make much sense to many people. But in the end, I would like to see one person come up with a good reason d20 is a good system.

--Miranda

[Thalantos]

Originally posted by SteveD
And Thantalos misses the joke!

But we have these lovely parting gifts for you...


Yeah.

Got it RIGHT after i posted, grrr! My brain is farting too badly today.

Oooh, what gifts?

[SteveD]

It's a nametag! So I don't misspell your name again!

AND Tupperware!

Steve

[Miranda]

Can I have a gift, SteveD?

No particular reason.

I just want a gift.

:D

--Miranda

[JPL]

Originally posted by Zamiel

Classic...I give it a 7 on the trollometer. Next time, more subtlety on teh spellig errars.
-Zam


I dunno....it's too over the top. No one is gonna go for it --- not after reading the work of the greats, like American Badass, or even Funksaw and Kamikaze.

And it's his first post, too. Too obvious.

[Bruce Baugh]

Sometimes people ask why it is that gamers get stereotyped as poorly socialized and lacking in perspective. Sometimes they don't need to ask.

[sys64738]

Originally posted by SteveD
It's like a kung-fu thread!

"My hate of d02 know no limit! You have bad honour against me! My now kill at you!"

I submit that, from now on, "my hate d02 know no limit" be the RPGNet equivalent of All your base.

:D

Steve

You chracter have no chance to sruvive! Make new char!

[Thalantos]

Originally posted by SteveD
It's a nametag! So I don't misspell your name again!

AND Tupperware!

Steve

Thanks

::pins name tag to chest::

ooh, tupperware!

[braincraft]

You might want to try disabling smilies in that last post. Yes, it is annoying that the forum software does that.

[Almafeta]

Originally posted by sys64738


You chracter have no chance to sruvive! Make new char!

Roll spherically 3d6!!! For great justice!!!!!!111

-- Shanya Almafeta

[Thalantos]

Edit: nothing, just ny comp acting lame

[sys64738]

Originally posted by Almafeta


Roll spherically 3d6!!! For great justice!!!!!!111

-- Shanya Almafeta

Take off evary 1!

[SteveD]

Someoen set us up the OGL!

Miranda, you can have some tupperware too. No reason. I just like ya.

Steve

[Jim DelRosso]

This thread has renewed my faith in RPG.net.

[Rezolution]

I tried translating this with Babelfish from English to French and back again to see if it would improve. Strangely, I think it did:

My hatred of d02 do not know any limit.

It fails in Juste approximately each aspect of a play, and it is more than one play of playign of rule that the role playing the game. Frist in addition to is to him manner with liniar.You become just better in everyway.THere is not any manner while avoiding carried out it it.I no MATER what are you, have you to have struck points and levels.

It is surplus comlicated, and simplist at the same time. IT is more difficult to strike a mmman in hammers of the dish armor.And and the swords tear the mail of chaim the same manner. Then you have the detail of when you can atack, and which weapons of range have, and at which distance you can move.

The classes, are the jokes really.From how the blows points.skill moves, and of the powers of allowance are moved approximately. At the end in boilings to the bottom with this the systems of levle not work.They can work with paper, but a combatant of level 12 or even magnetic does not need to fear to have a sword balanced with them, or to even obtain stabed.

Moreover with the blow in manner the points function, your one or the other which fights as if nothing occurred or are out of cold.Nothing in the medium. the straw to roll a d20 is also that the best combatant in the word, taking its more magic sword, the lack 5% of the time.

ALso thus all the combatants are right as good with all the weapons they use.We that all knows that the formation with the hand to give from the weapons will return to you large with a bow.Also if your good with guns, must know to you to use a sword.

In the final analysis, d20 is too many rules, and not enough of rules to same the time.Has too many rules of strick, while leaving much the open large feild without the reason. I ranting here, and know this dosen' T seems much of reasonable with many people.BUt at the end which I would like to see one come with a good reason d20 is a good system.

[Tamoline]

The curse of the proof reader strikes again...
Originally posted by Miranda


Classes are jokes, really. From how hits points, skill points, and bonus powers are moved about, in the end it boils down to this:



- I just hope I haven't made any mistakes.

[mearls]

This is the best thread ever. "My hate of d02 know no limit" is so catchy in a mentally challenged way. I think I'm going to use it as a short phrase to express resigned frustration.

[NPC Cheesecake]

"most magical" was my favorite part.

[Harbinger]

Originally posted by Jim DelRosso
This thread has renewed my faith in RPG.net.

This thread owes me a new keyboard!

[d3nial]

I propose the phrase be distilled down to MHO*KNL for brevity, where * = the object of your hatred.

For example, MHOscreeficeKNL, or MHOgwbushNKL...

d3nial

[Miranda]

Oh damnit, I knew I was gonna make a mistake! It's inevitable, when trying to be snarky about someone else's grammar and spelling, that you will yourself fuck up. Call it Miranda's Rool of Inurnet Speeling.

:)

It's OK, though.

Steve's giving me Tupperware, and that makes everything better.

--Miranda

[SteveD]

Steve's giving me Tupperware, and that makes everything better.

That sounds SO SEXY when you say it..

:D

Steve

[Zamiel]

Originally posted by JPL



I dunno....it's too over the top. No one is gonna go for it --- not after reading the work of the greats, like American Badass, or even Funksaw and Kamikaze.

And it's his first post, too. Too obvious.
Granted. The overall effect is what counts. Look at the first few responses.
See, American Badass gets a consistent 9, with the occasional 10. On a bad day, he would put out an 8 without trying. Funksaw and Kamikaze would do about the same.
The only time I saw someone get two 10s in a row was Bradford C. Walker. He never yells, or calls people names...
-Zam

[Tamoline]

Originally posted by Miranda
Oh damnit, I knew I was gonna make a mistake! It's inevitable, when trying to be snarky about someone else's grammar and spelling, that you will yourself fuck up. Call it Miranda's Rool of Inurnet Speeling.


Oh, completely. On the first draft of that post I buggered up the italics brackets. Even on a post that short I was not immune to fate's decree.

[Shining Dragon]

Originally posted by SteveD
It's like a kung-fu thread!

"My hate of d02 know no limit! You have bad honour against me! My now kill at you!"

I submit that, from now on, "my hate d02 know no limit" be the RPGNet equivalent of All your base.

:D

Steve

Such an accurate way of condensing the entire post.

If I was drinking something when I read this, I would have spurted it out through my nose...

[Tenacious B]

Originally posted by SteveD
I submit that, from now on, "my hate d02 know no limit" be the RPGNet equivalent of All your base.

Better yet, that sucker is going into my sig.

Cheers!

[Funksaw]

Originally posted by Corporate Dog
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you Funksaw's retarded little brother!!!!

Regards,
Corporate Dog

I don't have a little brother. And if I did, he wouldn't be retarded. And if he was, I wouldn't let him within 300 feet of a computer terminal.

[Funksaw]

Originally posted by Bruce Baugh
Sometimes people ask why it is that gamers get stereotyped as poorly socialized and lacking in perspective. Sometimes they don't need to ask.

I don't know, Bruce. I think that that 500 pound bearded guy in the Sailor Moon costume did much more to pound that myth into mainstream thought than any poster.

-- Funky.

[mathey]

Danger all posters. Must be talking the english in clear terms so as to. be, correctly understood! Please refer to own work when typing it. or else you will make a

mistake.
Thank you for all consideration. Enjoy happy fun shrimp.

[Pseudo Nymh]

Originally posted by Mark Bruno


Better yet, that sucker is going into my sig.

Cheers!

Wouldn't it be cool if we ALL put that in our sig? :D

Hundreds of posters, all with the same inane sig.

-Nymh, who has a strange sense of humor.

[mearls]

The only thing that would make this thread better is if the original poster was named Silent Whale instead of Silent Wail.

I just picture this killer whale, stalking around dungeons, leaping from the shadows to scream at hapless D&D adventurers:

"MY HATE OF d02 KNOW NO LIMIT!"

And then, his message delivered, he fades back into the shadows.








Yeah, I'm weird.

[Bradford C. Walker]

Funniest thread yet today. Can't stop laughing. Damn.

[Pseudo Nymh]

Originally posted by mearls
The only thing that would make this thread better is if the original poster was named Silent Whale instead of Silent Wail.

I just picture this killer whale, stalking around dungeons, leaping from the shadows to scream at hapless D&D adventurers:

"MY HATE OF d02 KNOW NO LIMIT!"

And then, his message delivered, he fades back into the shadows.


You just about owed me a new keyboard with that one! :D

I am SO including this in the next dungeon crawl I run for my players. :)

-Nymh, still LOL

[Brand_Robins]

I'd like to thank this thread for my new sig. The whole axis of nations that kiss sheep was getting old. Finally I've found something more ludicrous and ill stated than a Bush speech!

[Jayman]

Originally posted by Brand_Robins
I'd like to thank this thread for my new sig. The whole axis of nations that kiss sheep was getting old. Finally I've found something more ludicrous and ill stated than a Bush speech!

You can call it "d02 axis of hate"

It reads kinda like a "What I did for summer vacation" in third grade speech.

Why I hate d02 by Silent Wail...........


Jay


EDIT: How do you change the font size in the SIG file?

Thanks

[Orange Man]

Originally posted by Pseudo Nymh


Wouldn't it be cool if we ALL put that in our sig? :D

Hundreds of posters, all with the same inane sig.

-Nymh, who has a strange sense of humor.


Damm it, I should have read it sooner!

[Epoch]

Originally posted by Jayman
EDIT: How do you change the font size in the SIG file?

Thanks

[size=x]Stuff within these tags will be abnormally sized. If x is 1, it'll be small text. If x is 3 or greater, it'll be larger in proportion to how big x is. I think it maxes at around 7 or so.[/size]

(Of course, I escaped the []'s, so they won't <i>actually</i> be larger or smaller. But just type that, and it should work out for you.)

[JDeMobray]

Between this and the "plea" threads, I can't stop laughing. Dammnit, I'm getting nothing done today.

[A silent wail]

IT doesn't mater much. The d20 system, is basically an improvement on a game, that should be scraped. I mean, it is the "boy band" of role playing games.

And the fact is, not only is a fucked up game.It is infesting other games,as many games are not going to the d20 system.


You could point the typos in my last post.Great, you must be really bored.

But can anyone tell me a solid reason d20 is a good system?Other than it is better than other broken games. Yes it is better than AD&D.Guess what diet coke is better than diet caffeine coke.Does that make diet coke good?

[Harbinger]

Originally posted by A silent wail


Guess what diet coke is better than diet caffeine coke.Does that make diet coke good?

To a large portion of the soda drinking world. Yes it does.

[Cirv]

Originally posted by A silent wail
But can anyone tell me a solid reason d20 is a good system?Other than it is better than other broken games. Yes it is better than AD&D.Guess what diet coke is better than diet caffeine coke.Does that make diet coke good?

NO! My hate deit coke know no limit!

[Miranda]

ahem.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Silent Wail, you gotta stop. You're killing me! :D

And, just in case you didn't get the message, people aren't going to respond to what is an obvious, and poorly done, troll.

Kisses! :D

--Miranda

[Caelic]

IT doesn't mater much.

The truest thing that's been said thus far. (Though I wonder if it paters much?)



The d20 system, is basically an improvement on a game, that should be scraped.

Scrape it! Scrape it severely!!! Yes, you must give us all a GOOD scraping!!




I mean, it is the "boy band" of role playing games.

AHA! I KNEW it! Tordek, Jozan, and Krusk moonlight crooning love ballads for twelve year old girls!


[/QUOTE]And the fact is, not only is a fucked up game.It is infesting other games,as many games are not going to the d20 system.[/QUOTE]

How, exactly, does one game 'infest' another? Is there any kind of spray or powder you can buy for that?


You could point the typos in my last post.Great, you must be really bored.

Pretty humongously bored, yes. I have time to sit here and read meaningless threads, after all.


But can anyone tell me a solid reason d20 is a good system?Other than it is better than other broken games. Yes it is better than AD&D.Guess what diet coke is better than diet caffeine coke.Does that make diet coke good?


Last I checked, it's about the third most popular soft drink on the planet.

Okay. All jokes aside, ONE solid reason it's a good system. A logical proposition for you:

A. Many, many people have a good time using it.

B. The primary purpose of a roleplaying game is to have a good time.

C. Therefore, the D20 system has accomplished its primary task.

[Silent Whale]

Originally posted by A silent wail
The d20 system, is basically an improvement on a game, that should be scraped.

I scraped my copy of d02 Modern with a piece of sand paper.

Now what?

It's really scuffed up now.

Is that good?

Dammit, I'm the worst silent whale of all time! I keep making these noises!

By the way, my hate of d02 also know no limit.

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by mearls
This is the best thread ever. "My hate of d02 know no limit" is so catchy in a mentally challenged way. I think I'm going to use it as a short phrase to express resigned frustration.

The phrase was choice enough to be included in my sig.

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by Orange Man



Damm it, I should have read it sooner!

No joke. Me too.

[John Wick]

I was laughing. Out loud. My grin from ear to ear, almost aching. And then, I came across this:

Originally posted by SteveD
It's like a kung-fu thread!

"My hate of d02 know no limit! You have bad honour against me! My now kill at you!"


Ladies and gentlemen,
I give you Steve D,
The kung fu ork.

(And who says haiku can't be funny?)

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by John Wick
I was laughing. Out loud. My grin from ear to ear, almost aching. And then, I came across this:



Ladies and gentlemen,
I give you Steve D,
The kung fu ork.

(And who says haiku can't be funny?)

My hate of D02
Silent Wail is a sad Troll
Much Laughing Ensues

w00t!

[Nilus]

Originally posted by Cirv


NO! My hate deit coke know no limit!

You owe me a new Keyboard. I just got Diet coke all over mine

[Nilus]

Originally posted by mearls
I just picture this killer whale, stalking around dungeons, leaping from the shadows to scream at hapless D&D adventurers:

"MY HATE OF d02 KNOW NO LIMIT!"

And then, his message delivered, he fades back into the shadows.


Welcome to me sig

[Lord-Loaf]

Originally posted by A silent wail
IT doesn't mater much. The d20 system, is basically an improvement on a game, that should be scraped. I mean, it is the "boy band" of role playing games.

And the fact is, not only is a fucked up game.It is infesting other games,as many games are not going to the d20 system.


You could point the typos in my last post.Great, you must be really bored.

But can anyone tell me a solid reason d20 is a good system?Other than it is better than other broken games. Yes it is better than AD&D.Guess what diet coke is better than diet caffeine coke.Does that make diet coke good?


Play, someking, else then. Im sure you would rather be playing Call of Thculu than whinging about D02.

If D02 has released its spores and infested Thculu? Well, just scrape it clean dude.

[RobotHead]

Could this be the most sig-ified thread, evar?

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by Lord-Loaf
Play, someking, else then. Im sure you would rather be playing Call of Thculu than whinging about D02.

If D02 has released its spores and infested Thculu? Well, just scrape it clean dude.

Excuse me while I climb off the floor and regain my composure.

Robothead, if it's not the most sig'd thread, it has to be in the top 10. :)

[Elemental]

Originally posted by Zamiel

Granted. The overall effect is what counts. Look at the first few responses.
See, American Badass gets a consistent 9, with the occasional 10. On a bad day, he would put out an 8 without trying. Funksaw and Kamikaze would do about the same.
The only time I saw someone get two 10s in a row was Bradford C. Walker. He never yells, or calls people names...
-Zam

And then there was that Zoran guy. He was great fun, though somewhat creepy.

[Michael T. Richter]

Originally posted by Pseudo Nymh
Wouldn't it be cool if we ALL put that in our sig? :D

Hundreds of posters, all with the same inane sig.

-Nymh, who has a strange sense of humor.

Nah. That would just be stupid.

[Jayman]

My hate of d02 know no limit

Get in my Sig **vioce of FatBastard**

LMAO at this thread.

Jay

[NPC NPCCow]

Originally posted by Miranda
ahem.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Silent Wail, you gotta stop. You're killing me! :D

And, just in case you didn't get the message, people aren't going to respond to what is an obvious, and poorly done, troll.

Kisses! :D

--Miranda


Yup no one responds and its on its 4th page. ;)

Total score so far: 11pts.

Not bad but he had to post to his own thread so it cost 'em on style.

[Peter LaCara]

I think A Silent Wail and Saitou Hajime should get together, we could mix their genetic material, and make the most hilarious troll ever! Or is that EVAR? Ye gods, wouldn't that be a match made in hell?

[Shining Dragon]

I suspect "A silent wail" really meant to call himself "A silent plea" or "A quiet plea" but the translation got mixed up.

[RobotHead]

Originally posted by Peter LaCara
I think A Silent Wail and Saitou Hajime should get together, we could mix their genetic material, and make the most hilarious troll ever! Or is that EVAR? Ye gods, wouldn't that be a match made in hell?

I'm sure our good old pal HYBRID could supply us the equation for this.

[Korr]

My hate of oatmeal know no limit.

[access.denied]

Originally posted by Elemental
And then there was that Zoran guy. He was great fun, though somewhat creepy.
You mean ZAON Netrep? I'm not sure, but the description fits him exactly.

And damn, mearls' Silent Whale story would have gotten me lots of strange looks if I wasn't alone in my room.

[Mr. Sluagh]

Oh, come on. A Silent Wail is *NOT* a troll. Believe me, I have experience with trolls. I've slammed their inane nitpicks into the ground. I've called them out to prove their cowardess. I know a troll when I see one, and when I turn my Kenning on this poster, I do not see blue skin and horns (li'l C:tD reference for ya ;) ). A Silent Wail's posts are very contraversial, have poor spelling and grammar and are mildly inflammatory (but not anywhere near over the line). None of these things reflects on his integrity or the validity of his opinions, separately or as one. I agree with many of his points, and although I believe that players of the d20 system have an inalienable right to play and enjoy that system (mind you, there was a time when I didn't, but I don't like to talk about it :( ), I do personally think that d20 is a shitty system and am becoming quite alarmed at the trend towards good games with good systems being converted to d20, often at the expense of their original lines and their original systems and I believe that Hasbro is becoming a monopoly, if it isn't one already (this is most likely what Wail was talking about when he said the d20 was infesting other games, as if you didn't already know :mad: ). So please. Don't take the easy way out of what could turn (could've turned?) into a good debate. A Silent Wail doesn't deserve to be flamed (and that is what this is — a one-sided flame war) just because he has contraversial opinions and bad spelling and grammar. Did it ever occur to you that English might not be his first language or that he might have Dyslexia or some similar disability? I don't know, maybe I'm missing something, but please, either point out what it is or give A Silent Wail a chance.


P.S. I'm not kidding.

[Jayman]

Originally posted by Mr. Sluagh
Don't take the easy way out of what could turn (could've turned?) into a good debate. A Silent Wail doesn't deserve to be flamed (and that is what this is — a one-sided flame war) just because he has contraversial opinions and bad spelling and grammar. Did it ever occur to you that English might not be his first language or that he might have Dyslexia or some similar disability? I don't know, maybe I'm missing something, but please, either point out what it is or give A Silent Wail a chance.

P.S. I'm not kidding.

Well for starters he could have done a search for the countless other threads of "I hate d20" or "Why d20 sucks". If he wanted to vent place it there with the other opinions.

Did he say anything that we havnt heard before? NO!



Jay

[pointyman2000]

I normally don't add stuff to my sig, but this is too good to pass up. :D

[Silent Whale]

Originally posted by Mr. Sluagh
P.S. I'm not kidding.

It's never a good sign when you type that and mean it.

And anyways, I think your points would've been much better made had you simply written:

MY HATE OF d02 KNOW NO LIMIT.

I mean, you can't get any more concise, on topic, and compelling than that.

A silent wail has shown us the light. His hate of d02 know no limit, nor do mine, nor do yours. In fact, I think it's safe to say that the entire world can come together and say our hate of d02 know no limit.

In time, this phrase shall bring peace to the world. This simple sentence, this half-formed, borderline moronic bleat, "My hate of d02 know no limit" is our God, and A Silent Wail is its prophet.

Our father, who art in heaven,
My hate of d02 know no limit.
Amen.

[Silent Whale]

Originally posted by Jayman
Did he say anything that we havnt heard before? NO!


This is not true. He did say my hate of d02 know no limit. This was a very novel thing to say, something that I hope to transform into a religion.

To the Flash studio!

[Mr. Sluagh]

Originally posted by Jayman


Well for starters he could have done a search for the countless other threads of "I hate d20" or "Why d20 sucks". If he wanted to vent place it there with the other opinions.

Did he say anything that we havnt heard before? NO!

Well, I'm new to this forum and hadn't realized that, although I now see in hindsight that it should have been quite obvious. However, the same is probably true of A Silent Wail, and I really don't think he deserves this kind of abuse.

[Bradford C. Walker]

My sides hurt because I'm laughing so hard.

[braincraft]

Ahem.


I HAVE NO MOUTH, AND I MUST WAIL

[Kai Tave]

We should get A silent wail and Silent Whale together for a no-holds-barred steel cage deathmatch, and the winner should become the next moderator. Either way it swings, comedy gold is bound to follow.

[Mr. Sluagh]

Yeah, I have to admit that this thread did make me laugh my ass so far off that I'm printing out wanted posters for it. Still, I don't think this is right.

[Killer GM]

I just read this entire thread, and I can no longer feel my legs. Is that bad?

Forget "all your base..." a slient wail is like the RPG.net equivelent of Timecube.com (http://www.timecube.com/)...


I AM WIZEST GAMEMASTER! D02 IS ROLEPLAYING STUPID!


Oh, and Mr. Slaugh? One thing you'll learn is that nobody is safe from the mocking. NOBODY. That's what makes this place so damned fun! Don't let it scare you off, man.

[Brand_Robins]

Originally posted by Mr. Sluagh
Yeah, I have to admit that this thread did make me laugh my ass so far off that I'm printing out wanted posters for it. Still, I don't think this is right.

Welcome to the jungle, baby.

Normally there is more vitrolic and spewing of jizz involved in RPG.net tearing a troll down. This particular troll, however, has been so wonderfully amusing that we've decided to take another route, one that will create a lasting legacy -- out hate stuped troll know no limit.

[mudguard]

So, then, I'm the only one who saw D02 and thought about some kind of mirror world where their D02 system consisted of rolling lots of d02s around and the flowetihW games consisted of rolling only one d01 to resolve things? Really?

*goes back under the rock*

-m

[Harlequin Jones]

D02 sucks. Prince Valiant deserved better.



HJ

[NPC_lucid]

No he doesn't. Look at that unfashionable bowel cut.

It's shameful.

[Forum Administrator]

Originally posted by Mr. Sluagh
Yeah, I have to admit that this thread did make me laugh my ass so far off that I'm printing out wanted posters for it. Still, I don't think this is right. Hello, new person.

As a moderator here, I can only defend someone from someone else - I cannot defend them from themselves.

Obviously Mr. Wail has issues which require deep therapy or maybe a hug.

Rarely will one find those by posting a Classic Troll.

[Greg H]

"Obviously Mr. Wail has issues which require deep therapy or maybe a hug."

Actually, Mr. Wail should try to copyright the saying or something, get it put on a t-shirt (nice black tee with "MY HATE OF D02 KNOW NO LIMIT on the front) and sell these em' at GENCON...


you'd never have to work again...

[Jeremy Cole]

Originally posted by Silent Whale


This is not true. He did say my hate of d02 know no limit. This was a very novel thing to say, something that I hope to transform into a religion.

To the Flash studio!

There are 13 prophets of My Hate of D02 know no limit, and A Silent Wail is the seal.

Now all we need to do is decide who the other prophets would be (12 people who are vocal about not liking D&D, shouldn't be hard). Maybe we also need 99 names for A Silent Wail, and a holy land, but how hard could it all be?

[Carl Stanford]

I would buy one......

maybe we should contact cafepress?



Carl Stanford

[Rikimaru]

I would love a "my hate d02" T-Shirt. I think I'll go get one printed up before GenCon UK. After all, it's not like the gaming hobby doesn't have enough injokes. :)

Okay, now I'd better go do some work. I'm getting strange looks since I've been laughing on and off the last 10 minutes as I read this thread.

[adgboss]

Originally posted by A silent wail
It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game.

Frist off it is way to liniar.You just get better in everyway.THere is no way in avoiding it.I mena no mater what you are, you have have hit points and levels.

It is over comlicated,and simplist at the same time. IT is harder to hit a mmman in plate armor.And hammers and swords tear chaim mail the same way. Then you have the detail of when you can atack,and what range weapons have,and how far you can move.

Classes, are jokes. really.From how hits points.skill points,and bonus powers are moved about. In the end in boils down to this.

levle systems do not work.They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter or even mag doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabed. Also with the way hit points work, your either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold.Nothing in the middle.

the flaw of rolling a d20 is also that the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time.ALso so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use.We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow.Also if your good with guns, you must know how to use a sword.


In the end, d20 is too many rules, and not enough rules at the same time.Has too many strick rules, while leaving many feild wide open with no reason. I am ranting here,and know this dosen't make much sense to many people.BUt in the end I would like to see one come with a good reason d20 is a good system.

I am no longer RPG.net's absolute worse speller.... Yeah Baby, Yeah!

Makes my Column's bad edits seem brilliant in comparison

SMH
ADGBoss

[darelf]

Originally posted by NPC_lucid
No he doesn't. Look at that unfashionable bowel cut.

It's shameful.

Ouch... a bowel cut. It can't feel very pleasant to have your bowels cut.

[adgboss]

Originally posted by Mr. Sluagh
Yeah, I have to admit that this thread did make me laugh my ass so far off that I'm printing out wanted posters for it. Still, I don't think this is right.

If I could step away from the Humor for a moment, I honestly think the reason this person is suffering such tremendous ridicule is that he literally had (and has)thousands of posts to examine and get a good idea of the kind of posts that might generate good debate. This is not some 40 year old meanie verbally spanking a 13 year old at the LGS because he called an Ogre and "Orge". Instead we have fairly witty people frustrated by the constant barrage of:

"D20 Rokz so bda! Thae shuld maek Shadwrunn d2o!"

and

"D20 sukz... WOTC sukz... Plae Snecod Editan!"


Or perhaps I am way off base and we are all bastards (and bastardettes for the ladies) with nothing good to say about anyone.

SMH
ADGBoss

[adgboss]

Plus he also could have used the gdamn Edit button (as I did on my previous post) when he realised his Spelling mistakes

SMH
ADGBoss

[darelf]

Originally posted by adgboss

Or perhaps I am way off base and we are all bastards (and bastardettes for the ladies) with nothing good to say about anyone.

SMH
ADGBoss

Damn you! I wanted to be a bastardette. It just sounds so cool. I didn't realize you were gender-biased in giving out cool titles.

[Sangrolu]

Originally posted by mearls
I just picture this killer whale, stalking around dungeons, leaping from the shadows to scream at hapless D&D adventurers:

"MY HATE OF d02 KNOW NO LIMIT!"

And then, his message delivered, he fades back into the shadows.


I just reviewed a d20 product with Orca as a player race, so you wouldn't even have to make up your own stats. :D

[adgboss]

Originally posted by darelf


Damn you! I wanted to be a bastardette. It just sounds so cool. I didn't realize you were gender-biased in giving out cool titles.

Well ok Bastardette can be cross-gendered, I have no issues there.

SMH
ADGBoss

[Labmonkey-XL]

My d02 work note god. I rol dise and the numbre confues me playn. Y erytime i play wiht the d02 it make me anger.

I will wright reveiw on RGP.com aboot badniss of the d200. I hat wiht passion i do.

I go playe Mage Night now... the rules doont mak earrs bleed the redd bloody.

ALL YOUR BASES!!!

[Mock]

God dammit, the things I miss. I nearly blew an O-ring laughing at this thread.

MHO*KNL. Heeee.

[gorman]

Originally posted by Shining Dragon
If I was drinking something when I read this, I would have spurted it out through my nose... Had I been drinking something I would have spurted it out through my nose, reading you remark! :)

[WonderRat]

Sorry Silent Wail but any hope you could have had for a nice flame was ruined. But hey you are popular now, everyone is quoting ya.

[Dr. Awkward]

Man oh man. The stuff I miss when I stop checking Open every so often.

These sorts of posts always make me think of Darren's classic statement about the difficulty some people must have when banging their ass against the keyboard to type an RPGnet post.

And that gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling.



- my hate of DocAwk know no limit

[Redforce]

Open can now have it's own singing group! Fronted by Silent Wail, with adgboss & darelf as backup singers!

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, I PRESENT TO YOU...

d02 And The Bastardettes!

[Mr. Sluagh]

Okay, I get it now. Like I said, I'm new here.

Btw, I call dibs on Second Prophet.:D

'Course, I'm already the He who Liketh Changelingeth, the Fallen Thirdeth Messiaheth of Nocturnis, but my power has been usurped by Evil Empryss and her unholy legions and Temnix, the Second Messiah of Nocturnis hasn't been seen for ages, so I guess I've got an opening for a place in a forum's "metaplot" once more.:)

[adgboss]

Originally posted by Phillip
Open can now have it's own singing group! Fronted by Silent Wail, with adgboss & darelf as backup singers!

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, I PRESENT TO YOU...

d02 And The Bastardettes!

Hey now I want THAT on a T-Shirt

lol

SMH
ADGBoss

[gamethyme]

Originally posted by adgboss


Or perhaps I am way off base and we are all bastards (and bastardettes for the ladies) with nothing good to say about anyone.

SMH
ADGBoss

Why is this an "Or" proposition?

What if we're all literate, erudite intelligent bastards with nothing good to say about anyone?

[adgboss]

Originally posted by gamethyme


Why is this an "Or" proposition?

What if we're all literate, erudite intelligent bastards with nothing good to say about anyone?

Uhm...

but we're not...

Ok but lets assume we are, I have no issue with that

Amend the above to And/Or


SMH
ADGBoss

[Sangrolu]

Originally posted by Jayman
Well for starters he could have done a search for the countless other threads of "I hate d20" or "Why d20 sucks". If he wanted to vent place it there with the other opinions.

Did he say anything that we havnt heard before? NO!

But he was certainly more entertaining. :)

[TSOB]

!

It's like Time Cube with bad spelling.

....my brain is melting...

:eek:

[Bradford C. Walker]

I think that Silent Wail's a hitman sent by insane anti-d20 forces to kill me, because I'm dying of laughter.:D

--smiling corpse Walker

[JDCorley]

In the immortal words of Captain America from the old Avengers arcade game....


<h3>I CAN'T MOOOVE!!</h3>

[NPC Old DM]

LOL, this has got to be one of the funniest posts I have ever read!

No, I don't think he is a troll, but a sincerely frustrated gamer who just wanted to express his displeasure of d20. I think it is a rather cute post actually, very innocent and raw in its sincerity.

Anhyow my hate for d02 no no limit either. And yes chammail and plammail hitz diffirintly!

[Mr. Sluagh]

Originally posted by NPC Old DM
LOL, this has got to be one of the funniest posts I have ever read!

No, I don't think he is a troll, but a sincerely frustrated gamer who just wanted to express his displeasure of d20. I think it is a rather cute post actually, very innocent and raw in its sincerity.

Anhyow my hate for d02 no no limit either. And yes chammail and plammail hitz diffirintly!

Ditto, on all accounts.

[pawsplay]

All your dice are belong to us!

[Elemental]

Originally posted by pawsplay
All your dice are belong to us!

What you say?!

[Peter LaCara]

Y'know, it's possible that he might not be a troll. He may just be an idiot.

[Cirv]

Originally posted by Peter LaCara
Y'know, it's possible that he might not be a troll. He may just be an idiot.

Does that mean he deserve's more respect or less? :confused:

[Korr]

Originally posted by Elemental


What you say?!

Remove all character sheet.

[Korr]

Originally posted by Greg H
"Obviously Mr. Wail has issues which require deep therapy or maybe a hug."

Actually, Mr. Wail should try to copyright the saying or something, get it put on a t-shirt (nice black tee with "MY HATE OF D02 KNOW NO LIMIT on the front) and sell these em' at GENCON...


you'd never have to work again...

Done and done.

Ads/Open Promo (http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32198)

[NPC Old DM]

Originally posted by Peter LaCara
Y'know, it's possible that he might not be a troll. He may just be an idiot.

Now, now, that is just plain unnecessary!

Again, I thought it was the funniest post I've read in a while. Pure emotion pouring into that beautiful piece of work, ah~!

Also, the kungfu correlation comment was very good. ;)

[Teh Clawring Crabe]

I hate d20 becuase it KILLS!

It just sneaks up behind you then... SMASH!

Look out behind you lady! It wants your BABY!
http://www.elphaba.com/stomp/images/d20.jpg

Note: I know I posted this elsewhere, but it's more likely to be seen here.

[Sparrowhawk]

ROFLMAO! :D

[Sparrowhawk]

Wow. I killed it.

[NephilBlade]

I refuse to let you kill this thread. I haven't killed any, thus I shall kill it.

[The Eye]

Originally posted by Sparrowhawk
Wow. I killed it.

my hate of 5p4Rrr0w h4wk know no lmit!!!111

[Jay]

Just because.

bump

(Y'know, this one should be kept in the 'best of' files, if it still exists. Or else, made sticky.)

[J. H. Frank]

Originally posted by Jay
(Y'know, this one should be kept in the 'best of' files, if it still exists. Or else, made sticky.)

I'm sure someone's making this sticky RIGHT NOW!

IKWIM, AITYD.

[RedFox]

I could've sworn I had a post in this thread, but now it's gone.

feels like he's hallucinating -- RedFox

[gale_wolf]

Here I am minding my own business, looking for something interesting to read, and what do I find?

teh. btes. danm. pots. EVRA!

[bentleyml]

Wow. I must say this has been one of the most entertaining threads I have read in a long time on any board. I laughed so hard I cried. Keep up the good work people. :)

[NPC_lucid]

Originally posted by RedFox
I could've sworn I had a post in this thread, but now it's gone.

feels like he's hallucinating -- RedFox

You have been censored by the jackbooted thug moderators for dissenting.

I hear them banging on my door...

I may not return.

[Noon]

If you write (shit about) it, they (sarcastic bastards) will come.

Like seaguls around hot chips. Where's the alka selsa?

I wonder how many actual ideas have been treated to fewer pages?

Not that the post wasn't funny!

[Sir Hawkeye]

I proclaim myself third prophet.
MHO(enemies of MHO*KNL)KNL

[Selim The Grim]

Can we make Funksaw and Kamikaze the fourth and fifth prophets of MHOD02KNL? Or are they merely John-the-Baptist figures? Or should I not mishmash monotheisms?

[Yuri]

has anybody else noticed that this thread has gotten more views than any other post in the RPG.net forums?

Scary.

Mr Hart

[Jim DelRosso]

Originally posted by Mr_Hart
has anybody else noticed that this thread has gotten more views than any other post in the RPG.net forums?

Scary.

Mr Hart

Has it beaten the thread about The Riddle of Steel?

[Yuri]

Okay.... so it's number 15.... but its going... up...up...and up!

Mr Hart

[Jayman]

Originally posted by Mr_Hart
Okay.... so it's number 15.... but its going... up...up...and up!

Mr Hart

In a very short amount of time I might add.


Jay

[braincraft]

Originally posted by Mr_Hart
has anybody else noticed that this thread has gotten more views than any other post in the RPG.net forums?

Scary.

Mr Hart

Not even close.


Lookie at the Serial who'd win thread.

[Shining Dragon]

Yeah.

But does your hate of d02 know no limit?

[d3nial]

MHO(serial who'd win)KNL


d3

[RedFox]

Originally posted by NPC_lucid


You have been censored by the jackbooted thug moderators for dissenting.

I hear them banging on my door...

I may not return.

Hate to jump to conclusions, but...

[Korr]

Originally posted by d3nial
MHO(serial who'd win)KNL


d3

Shouldn't that be:

MHO(serial win who'd)KNL

:confused:

[d3nial]

you're right...

MHO(cereal hoodwink)KNL

d3

[NPC_lucid]

Originally posted by RedFox


Hate to jump to conclusions, but...

But jumping to conclusions and leaping to the perjorative are the most popular sports and forms of excercise on this board.

[James Gillen]

Originally posted by Shining Dragon
Yeah.

But does your hate of d02 know no limit?

I like D20 well enough.
But my hate of d02 know no limit.

JG

[Marius B]

my hat of do2 no know limit too! it stupid that is u can olny role nombers bwten 1 an 20 on dises. begiing charcters can nver be at anthiygh reel good. bets begning fihgtre wil stil ahve as kickd by hi-vlv wizzrd even if wizard has...


Oh God, I can't do it. This guy's a genius!

I wish he'd post some more...

Cheers,
M is for My hate of do2 know no limit!

[The Eye]

Originally posted by NPC_lucid


But jumping to conclusions and leaping to the perjorative are the most popular sports and forms of excercise on this board.


my hate of hiJ4kin this thr3d f0R p0lTik4l purpusses kn0w no Lmit!!!11!!!1

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by dyjoots



my hate of hiJ4kin this thr3d f0R p0lTik4l purpusses kn0w no Lmit!!!11!!!1

my hate of l33+ 5p33k know no limit!

[Caelic]

I wonder...would the original post qualify as Engrish or not? (No way of really knowing if it was written by someone for whom English is a foreign language, but still...)

[pawsplay]

I think to be true Engrish, it has to be butched in the Japanese style.

Actually, considering the number of errors, this guy did a pretty good job of getting his point across.

[Crusader808]

Originally posted by pawsplay
I think to be true Engrish, it has to be butched in the Japanese style.

Actually, considering the number of errors, this guy did a pretty good job of getting his point across.

By that do you mean, he Trolled poorly and made us all laugh? :)

[Jimmy]

<img src="http://members.ams.chello.nl/paeijk/plaatjes/turtle1.jpg"></img>

[SmegMOnkey]

Originally posted by Jimmy
<img src="http://members.ams.chello.nl/paeijk/plaatjes/turtle1.jpg"></img>

now thats funny

[NPC Old DM]

A Silent Wail really lives up to his name. Two posts and quiet now. Can we hear from him again? I would get a kick out of just seeing another one of his posts.

[Krono]

My hate of D02 know no limit.

It deserved to be restated.

[Korr]

My, but that's an angry little reptile.

[Bradford C. Walker]

HE'S BACK! Silent Wail is BACK! HOO-RAY!

--loves the black comedy Walker

[hong]

Originally posted by J. H. Frank

IKWIM, AITYD.

What a strange acronym.

[Afshin]

I demand that this thread stay on the first page. DEMAND.

[gentrification]

http://www.edromia.com/knownolimit.jpg

[gentrification]

Okay, I give up. How does one go about making an image appear in one's message?

[Epoch]

Originally posted by gentrification
Okay, I give up. How does one go about making an image appear in one's message?

&lt;img src="http://some.image.url"&gt

(For example:

<img src="http://www.edromia.com/knownolimit.jpg">

)

[gentrification]

Ah. So simple. And yet, so not intuitive from the interface provided.

[Epoch]

Originally posted by gentrification
Ah. So simple. And yet, so not intuitive from the interface provided.

Your kung fu is weak, Gentry. ;)

[gamethyme]

Originally posted by Epoch


Your kung fu is weak, Gentry. ;)

In all fairness, his Kung Fu is irrelevant.

In this case, his Geek Fu is weak.

[Silent Whale]

Originally posted by hong


What a strange acronym.

Those aren't acronyms.

"IKWIM, AITYD!!!" is Korean for "My hate of d02 know no limit."

[gentrification]

Originally posted by gamethyme
In all fairness, his Kung Fu is irrelevant.

In this case, his Geek Fu is weak.

Actually, in all fairness, I <i>do</i> know how HTML image tags work.

I just assumed, stupidly, that since there are two other ways of (apparently) inserting images into posts provided by the forum interface, that the standard way of doing it wouldn't work. It was kind of a hidden-in-plain-sight sort of thing.

[Epoch]

Originally posted by gentrification


Actually, in all fairness, I <i>do</i> know how HTML image tags work.

I just assumed, stupidly, that since there are two other ways of (apparently) inserting images into posts provided by the forum interface, that the standard way of doing it wouldn't work. It was kind of a hidden-in-plain-sight sort of thing.

Almost all HTML tags work in this forum. The other ways of doing things are 'cause it's possible, in UBB, to turn off all those HTML tags.

[gentrification]

Originally posted by Epoch


Almost all HTML tags work in this forum. The other ways of doing things are 'cause it's possible, in UBB, to turn off all those HTML tags.

Well, now I know. And knowing's half the battle.

[Epoch]

Originally posted by Silent Whale


Those aren't acronyms.

"IKWIM, AITYD!!!" is Korean for "My hate of d02 know no limit."

I'm too lazy to go back and figure out if you guys already know this, but it's an initialism for:

If you know what I mean, and I think you do.

[Elemental]

Have we found the next "All your base....." here?

[Qusoor]

ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO D02!

happy now?

[Selim The Grim]

Originally posted by Qusoor
ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO D02!


Yay for convergence.

Bump.

[Labmonkey-XL]

I get the sneaking suspicion that A silent Wail might be American Badass's Bizarro brother... or maybe someone who once roleplayed with AB once.... :eek:

[Kergillian]

Oh, no... I've been so good for so long... It's been over a year since his last appearance, but this one takes the cake...

IS GOBLIN BOY MAKING BIG RETURN!!!

Yes! You see, there is one more, he know everything about d02! D02 is POOPY! Is written by bunch of poopy pants designers, and is sold in poopy pants stores to poopy pants people!

Is very popular because everyone STUPID! Not like Goblin Boy, no! You think I say everyone stupid, so you think I stupid? Ha! I fool you! I smart! You stupid! You see? You see? I fool you again!

D02 filled with stupid rules! I make big fighter, I kill everything! I make goblin boy, I always die! THAT SO STUPID!!! I defeat everything, because real fighter only poopy fighter, and I use toilet right here! **FLUSH*** Ha, you think you make big fighter, kill everything, but you make poopy! I fool you yet again!

Is very bad that more you do stuff, more better you is. Because is no one better me! In real life, you not getting experience points, only poopy points, and go up poopy levels! Because classes are poopy!

Wait! You think I poopy, because I have classes? Ha! No! I am not poopy anything, because I HAVE NO CLASS!!!! I fool you a fourth time! Ha ha!

Is too easy fool you, too easy...

[LeumasWhite]

That was... odd. Not to mention poopy.

Edit: Spelling. My hate of illiteracy know no limit.

[Cossack]

hehehehehe
you guys said poopy
(shameless bump)

[pawsplay]

You really shouldn't gratuitously bump a thread.

Btw, d20 definitely has its place in the gaming world.

[Geoff Hall]

Mwahahahahahaha :D

OMG! I haven't been to rpg.net in months and one of the first things I read is this. Damn you all, I'm at work and I can't laugh this hard without getting really wierd looks.

Bwahahahahahahahahaha!

My hate of d02 know no limit Geoff

[Xeno]

I can't believe I didn't read this thread sooner.

Am I on crack or what?


And can I be a prophet of the Hate d02 religion? I hate d02! I really do!

[Mr. Sluagh]

Originally posted by Xeno
I can't believe I didn't read this thread sooner.

Am I on crack or what?


And can I be a prophet of the Hate d02 religion? I hate d02! I really do!

Of course! We welcome you to our holy ranks and dub thee Xeno, He who May or May Not be on Crack, Sixth Prophet of My hate of d02 know no limit.! (commences Pattented Prophet Welcoming Song and Dance)

[Arbitan]

Someone set us up the d02!

All your d02 are belong to us

[Sir Hawkeye]

Originally posted by Xeno
I can't believe I didn't read this thread sooner.

Am I on crack or what?


And can I be a prophet of the Hate d02 religion? I hate d02! I really do!

Of course you can! They let me in, and I just randomly seized power around page 8 or 9 or so.

More prophets! We need more prophets! My Hate of Recruiting Difficulties Know No Limit!

We need to perform the secret paracthulian psychoaviance ritual before the next full moon, people!

Wheeeeeeeee-HOO-HOO-HA-HA-HA!!!!!!

[Mr. Sluagh]

Originally posted by Sir Hawkeye


Of course you can! They let me in, and I just randomly seized power around page 8 or 9 or so.

More prophets! We need more prophets! My Hate of Recruiting Difficulties Know No Limit!

We need to perform the secret paracthulian psychoaviance ritual before the next full moon, people!

Wheeeeeeeee-HOO-HOO-HA-HA-HA!!!!!!

I'll start a new thread to recruit more Prophets.

[Labmonkey-XL]

I cast Resurrection. For no particular reason.

[Sir Hawkeye]

Huzzah! It returns from the briny deep!

[dalziel_86]

Originally posted by Labmonkey-XL
I cast Resurrection. For no particular reason.
I attack the Darkness. Who is this 'Darkness' anyway?

[Dragen3]

I claim 7th prophet of I hate d02.

[Dragen3]

"Okay. All jokes aside, ONE solid reason it's a good system. A logical proposition for you:

A. Many, many people have a good time using it.

B. The primary purpose of a roleplaying game is to have a good time.

C. Therefore, the D20 system has accomplished its primary task."

Being one of the people of Catogory A I really must agree with this proposition.

"There is only 1 thing you must keep in mind to be an excellent DM. Sadly, no one knows what this is. - Pseudo Nymph"

As a DM I think that the one thing you need to keep in mind is that the game is just there for fun and due to this you should not stick strictly to the rules.

[Kenshiro]

*STABBITY DEATH*

[Dragen3]

I attack the Darkness.
(The darkness dies you see more darkness) Maybe you should try casting Light.

[The Eye]

Originally posted by Dragen3
I attack the Darkness.
(The darkness dies you see more darkness) Maybe you should try casting Light.


i cast magic missle.

[Korr]

If there's girls there I wanna do them!

[Crusader808]

Hey! where's the mountain dew?

[-=[PALO]=-]

Yes, this subject sounds interesting, indeed.

[NPC Neverway]

Go to the following link and look around:

http://www.catholicsupply.com/christmas/othersports.html

Do you see a statue of little Jimmy and Jane sitting at one end of a table with The Lord at the other, behind a GM screen? No? You know why? It's because...

Jesus; hate of D02 know no limit!


You're going to burn! Burn I say! Bwa- ha-ha!

[Evan Waters]

Originally posted by NPC Neverway
Go to the following link and look around:

http://www.catholicsupply.com/christmas/othersports.html

Do you see a statue of little Jimmy and Jane sitting at one end of a table with The Lord at the other, behind a GM screen? No? You know why? It's because...

Jesus; hate of D02 know no limit!


You're going to burn! Burn I say! Bwa- ha-ha!

I particularly like that Skiing Jesus has his own pole. (Not that he needs it, he can just walk on the snow drifts, right?)

[Suicide King]

Those small statues have got to some of the most ridecilous crap I've ever seen.
Anohows, this thread is hilarious, though it seems to be mostly dead, yet still wobbling.

-Alexander

[NPC Random Jerk]

One of the un-dying threads.

I hope that everyone who have posted here will receive 100 spam letters for every post post made here :)

[NPC Billybo]

"It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game. "

Okay... the "rule playing" is a personal choice.

Some of us want a system whereby it makes a difference if we're using a bastard sword or long sword. Some of us want a system where we can differentiate between agile but average-strength combatants and strong but average-agility combatants.

Simpler games-- games with less rules -- often have no meaningful game-mechanical differentiation between such things. I saw a kind of nice looking free game about 1920's pulp, but I didn't like it, because Strenght and Agliity were lumped together as "Body." This might not bother some; it bothers me.

Some people just say, "Well, just ROLEPLAY the differences!" I get a little sick of hearing that. It's like some hackneyed slogan at a 12-step fat camp. "It's not a DIE-et, it's a LIVE-it!" You know, that advice is kinda meaningless, and it still doesn't get to the heart of the complaint, to wit, that some people WANT a GAME MECHANICAL difference visible in situations that we perceive as different.

We don't just want to "ROLE PLAY THE DIFFERENCES!!!," you know, man? Ultimately, if you want to take the "Well just ROLE PLAY the differences!!!" idiocy far enough, you can play a game with no rules and only one state, Efficacy. The Efficacy stat measures your Efficacy at everything. If you want to play someone who's smart but not strong, well, JUST ROLE-PLAY THE DIFFERENCE!!!

This has been noted before, but it is the rules that keep role-playing games GAMES rather than pure make-pretend.

I could Just ROLE PLAY the difference between a Colt Python and a Beretta 9mm... but I don't WANT to. I want to know that when I make the choice for the heavier gun, I'm getting actual benefits (and suffering actual detriments, too). I don't want to JUST ROLE PLAY the kick of the Python.

Quite frankly, I don't know how. Maybe I just jerk my arm real hard when I shoot my imaginary gun and announce that I miss an awful lot-- you know, ROLE-PLAYING IT!

There is, ultimately, the matter of personal choice. Some people like just ROLE PLAYING it. Others want something approaching consistent mathematical rules. For that matter, some of us are mathematically, or at least arithmetically, inclined, and we don't really mind the small amount of number-crunching so much as.. we.. like... it?

Doctor Evil mode off.

This is a decision for each person. Rules light has its advantages, especially if you're in a combat-light game. Combat is always the killer. If you are in a combat-heavy game, you're gonna need some rules, unless you JUST ROLE PLAY!!! every fucking thing.

"Frist off it is way to liniar.You just get better in everyway.THere is no way in avoiding it.I mena no mater what you are, you have have hit points and levels. "

Well, yes, you get better in many ways (not "every" way-- your skills don't have to go up if you don't put points in them). But, so what? Further, you may get better in most ways, but not at the same rate-- a wizard gets better at fighting, but not much better at it, and he never actually becomes a combat threat to any opponent near his level.

"It is over comlicated,and simplist at the same time. "

Ahhhhhh... now we get closer. Yes, I think there is something to be said to this criticism. While I favor a rules-medium to rules heavy game, there is no getting around that some designs are more efficient, and deliver more in-game detail with fewer metagame rules.

D&D, I think, isn't terrible in thsi regard, but it is no Agile Mover. It is fat. Not morbidly obese, but it is quite chunky at a minimum. No one would look at D&D and call it "hot"-- unless you used to date her really fat older sisters, AD&D vol 1 and 2.



"IT is harder to hit a mmman in plate armor.And hammers and swords tear chaim mail the same way. Then you have the detail of when you can atack,and what range weapons have,and how far you can move. "

You fail to make legible points here. I understand that you are criticizing, but I don't understand the exact nature of the critique.

Yes, people move and attacdk and weapons have range and so do people's movement allowance. Yeah... as opposed to such things being infinite or something.

I know-- we could just ROLE-PLAY how much my accuracy degrades over 60 feet of range!

"Classes, are jokes. really.From how hits points.skill points,and bonus powers are moved about. In the end in boils down to this. "

Yes, this is true, but I don't see this as a criticism. The nature of the looser class system, where you can pick skills and feats, mean that it is not precise features which usually differentiate classes from eachother, but the rates at which characters gain bonusus in six different areas (attack, saves, skills, feats, magic, oddball specialty powers for each class).

"levle systems do not work.They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter or even mag doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabed. Also with the way hit points work, your either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold.Nothing in the middle. "

Understand that this is a critique of the exploding hit points system, not the level system per se.

"the flaw of rolling a d20 is also that the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time."

This is a flaw? If a flaw, then a terribly, terribly minor one.

"ALso so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use."

Not necessarily true. Characters can specialize in a weapon.

"We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow.Also if your good with guns, you must know how to use a sword."

Actually, I think there is some degree of real overlap even between very different combat forms.

But I do see this as a valid criticism.

But at this point you become incoherent. First you criticize the game for being too complex; but surely you know that in order to differentiate between one's skill with varying weapons I'd have to add in a whole new rule system (a branching-tree-skill-system for combat skill)?

I, for one, wouldn't mind such a rule system; but I can't say that would make the game "simpler," surely!




"In the end, d20 is too many rules, and not enough rules at the same time."

Actually, I think this is true, but probably not for the reasons you think it is.

All homebrews are created because someone thinks that something that should be modeled in the rules, is not modeled in the rules. Hence, for every homebrew artist out there, the game needs more rules in some areas, but probably not so many rules in the areas he doesn't care about.

[glass]

Originally posted by NPC Billybo
"It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game. "

Okay... the "rule playing" is a personal choice.

...etc


Well, it took 11 pages, but somebody finally took the bait :D

glass.

[NPC Random Jerk]

Originally posted by glass


Well, it took 11 pages, but somebody finally took the bait :D

glass.

Yeah, and he will be heavily cursed for this. His D20ies will make no bigger number than 5, and enemies will always score criticals. That's what people deserve for posting in this thread.

[Korimyr the Rat]

Originally posted by NPC Random Jerk
Yeah, and he will be heavily cursed for this. His D20ies will make no bigger number than 5, and enemies will always score criticals. That's what people deserve for posting in this thread.

With so much d02 polluting our gaming atmosphere, we have plenty to hate with no known limit that we shouldn't feel it necessary to hate on our fellow posters.

Well, unless they play d02, the rotten bastards.

[Dragen3]

All homebrews are created because someone thinks that something that should be modeled in the rules, is not modeled in the rules. Hence, for every homebrew artist out there, the game needs more rules in some areas, but probably not so many rules in the areas he doesn't care about.

This is true, as much of what was said is true.

The HP increase is supposed to represent the character being a little tougher but most of it acoording to the rules is that the character is more proficient at moving with the blow and therefore taking less damage. If you want a more realistic HP system make a homebrew. One major way to go around the fact that the level twelve fighter mentioned will have problems with the dagger strike is he gets hit in the throat, or the eyes, that sort of thing.

[darelf]

Originally posted by Dragen3
"There is only 1 thing you must keep in mind to be an excellent DM. Sadly, no one knows what this is. - Pseudo Nymph"

As a DM I think that the one thing you need to keep in mind is that the game is just there for fun and due to this you should not stick strictly to the rules.

Umm.... nope.
Try again.

[Dragen3]

You know that i'm wrong how?

[Bradford C. Walker]

Because the consistent application of the rules is fundamental to ensuring that the game is fun for everyone that participates. For all to have fun, the extremes must be curbed. Consistent use of the rules is the path to that goal.

--gaming guru Walker

[Scorpio Rising]

Originally posted by Bradford C. Walker
Because the consistent application of the rules is fundamental to ensuring that the game is fun for everyone that participates. For all to have fun, the extremes must be curbed. Consistent use of the rules is the path to that goal.
(Emphasis mine.)


Bradford, my respect for your d20 fu know no bounds. But I've got to disagree with you.

I've been playing (off and on) with the same group of buddies since we were ten. That's 17 years of game-play. We have two attitudes to the rules: Fast and Loose. And we have a (silent) whale of a time. Surely you don't mean to tell me that we haven't really had those 17 years of fun because we don't play the game "right"...?

I certainly agree with you that consistent application of the rules (by which I assume that you mean "consistently strict" as opposed to, say, "consistently fast and loose") is a path to the goal of people having fun, but I really can't bring myself to believe that it's The One True Way To Game.

Even in d20.

- Scorpio making it up as he goes along.


EDIT: Failure of emphasis: Using BOLD tags to highlight something in a quote is kind of a lost cause.... Changed them to italicses, precious.

[Bradford C. Walker]

Originally posted by Scorpio Rising
I've been playing (off and on) with the same group of buddies since we were ten. That's 17 years of game-play. We have two attitudes to the rules: Fast and Loose. And we have a (silent) whale of a time. Surely you don't mean to tell me that we haven't really had those 17 years of fun because we don't play the game "right"...?
Were you consistent in your use of the rules? If so, then we're not in disagreement.
I certainly agree with you that consistent application of the rules (by which I assume that you mean "consistently strict" as opposed to, say, "consistently fast and loose") is a path to the goal of people having fun, but I really can't bring myself to believe that it's The One True Way To Game.
I mean "consistent". I prefer "consistently strict", and I encourage people to go that way, but it's more important to be consistent than either strict or loose. Consistency goes a long way towards the creation and maintainance of verisimlitude, which is important because it defines the baseline reality of the campaign. Once players (and PCs) understand what the normal state of affairs is, the GM can safely deviate from it when the game requires it.

I'll put it another way: If I always say that armor adds to a PC's Armor Class, then it's a matter of dramatic tension when I say "No, your character's armor doesn't count towards his Armor Class vs. this attack." The player can reasonably deduce that I am not applying the rules inconsistently because I feel like it, or out of pique, etc. but rather because the situation is such that the PC's armor simply doesn't matter.

--am me talking gooder? Walker

[Scorpio Rising]

You am talking just fine. More props to your high WIS bonus.

FWIW, a very crunch-oriented player recently joined my d20 Dragon Lords game. (Which is with a different group from the "old skewl" one describe above -- nowadays I'm transatlantically challenged.) I've been enjoying sifting through the Feats, Skills, Weapons and combat maneuvers to find kewl combos to counteract his ridiculous Spiked-Chain/Improved Trip/Improved Disarm mastery. I like playing strict too, I guess.

There are many true ways to game. 'swhat makes it such a cool passtime.

- Scorpio striving for consistency.

[NPC Billybo]

"The HP increase is supposed to represent the character being a little tougher but most of it acoording to the rules is that the character is more proficient at moving with the blow and therefore taking less damage."

Sorry, mate, this is precisely what I mean by JUST ROLE-PLAY IT!!! When the Game Mechanics do not actually model an effect, but we're expected to smooth it over with role-playing or GM narration (12 points of damage! That's ANOTHER superficial nick you've taken, Master Fighter! You only can take ten more such superficial nicks!!!) then I, for one, am a bit annoyed.

There is a simpler, more intuitive way to model "reducing the damage inflicted by a blow," to wit, actually reducing the damage inflicted by a blow. If a fifteenth level fighter is turning most blows into weak hits, then give him 5 points of frigging hit point reduction and leave his actual hit points more or less unchanged.

Actually, there are better ways to do that too, but that's just the simplest.

"If you don't like the way damage works, make a homebrew."

WAAAAAY ahead of you, partner.

[Dragen3]

If a fifteenth level fighter is turning most blows into weak hits, then give him 5 points of frigging hit point reduction and leave his actual hit points more or less unchanged.

Makes sense and they have kind of caught that idea with the Barbarion class in D20. Although they could have got further with that idea.

[Bradford C. Walker]

I won't deny that the existing HP system has its flaws, but there is no alternative that fixes those flaws, retains its strengths and achieve acceptance from both the diehards (like us) and the far more common gamer crowd (that, for whatever reason, doesn't have such a problem with HP). As far as I'm concerned, all that is really necessary is something to address the wonky effects that magical healing often has on verisimilitude.

-- almost there Walker

[Dragen3]

Maybe its just because Player Characters are supposed to survive longer?

[NPC Billybo]

But you can make heroes live longer a lot of different ways. More hit points don't even really make heroes tougher anyway, because the opposition gets more hit points too.

I don't object to making heroes very durable. In fact, I don't think D&D really does anything in this direction.

I just think it's odd. "Defense" and "Luck" and "the knack of reducing a powerful blow to a weak one" are represented by INCREASING HIT POINTS.

Meanwhile, armor, which reduces the damage inflicted by a blow, is reflected in a character's Defensive Class (also known as AC).

Does this seem oddly backwards to anyone else?

In addition, if hit points are going to explode to represent a character's ability to, through defense, reduce a big injury to a little one, why the hell doesn't his ability to INFLICT hit point damage also explode? Shouldn't a d10 damage sword be doing 4d12 at level 16, then? Think about it: Hit Points are increasing to represent "defense." Presumably, then, hit-point injury should increase at the same rate to represent "offense."

Why the hell should two 16th level fighters take so long to chop each other down? Being equal, shouldn't the fight last just as long as one between two first level characters? Yes, they're both tougher, but they're also both much more dangerous. Why is that defense/ability to absorb injury so outstrips offense/ability to inflict injury?

Exploding hit points are just stupid, and they always have been, and, as far as the "problems" of D&D, 90% of all problems are directly traceable to this toxic point-source.

[NPC Billybo]

This is about the time that Justin Bacon warps in to explain why D&D is sublimely perfect, etc., etc., at least until the next edition, when he will proclaim THAT version the "best of all possible games" and the current version shite.


But for everyone who is so ready to defend hit points, can anyone explain why it wouldn't make just as much sense, if not more, to:

-- Increase AC (call it "DC") as characters rise in level

-- Use armor to contribute to Hit Points. If you like hit points so much, count a suit of plate armor as quadrupling your hit points (to represent ARMOR's ability to reduce each injury to a lesser injury). Chainmail adds x3; leather x2; studded leather x2.5, etc. Double-Chain addsx3.5.

Now, people of course will knock holes in that system. I just thought of the last part right now.

But how is that not just as good, if not better, than the current system? If additional hit points, past those one has at first level, can be defined as anything -- the current definition is "reducing the extent of an injury by defense and luck etc." -- why can't I say that additional hit points now tend to represent "the ability of ARMOR to reduce injury"?

In order to justify hit points, the game has been forced to abstract them into near-meaninglessness. Everyone knows what they're supposed to represent-- real toughness, real ability to resist injury. That's why CONSTITUTION adds to hit points, and not Dexterity. If hit points were really defense and luck, why doesn't Dexterity add to hit points rather than con?

And how come for monsters, it's a high AC that usually represents high defense (or actual armor, of course), but high hit points that represent actual physical ability to resist injury?


So, it makes no sense. To make it make something CLOSE to sense, the game has to say that hit points mean something completely different than what you assume they mean. They have abstracted the shit out of hit points, pulped them, hashed them into meaninglessness. They mean nothing now; they correspond to nothing in the real world. It is game mechanical conceit, a gamey element, pure and simple, and all the rationalization in the world isn't going to change that.

If hit points can mean anything, what the hell. Why can't they represent armor, as I postulate?

[Dragen3]

Don't know why armor can't be used to increase HP. Odds are that it came down to the fact that no one at the company wanted to explain why this is so which means it (as it frequently does with most anything) comes down to the DM to figure out if they like it the way it is wish to change it etc.

[NPC Billybo]

Well, yes, I think that's it to. My question was more rhetorical, and aimed at the Justin Bacon types who insist that the D&D way is the only "rational" way of doing it.

In fact, the D&D way is a pretty poor way of doing it. The game survives despite the HP system, not because of it. It is not a selling point.

Just about every single game on the market does it better.

Which is a genuine shame, because, as I've said before, D&D/d20 is the system I like most for chiefly sentimental reasons. I love the look and feal of the d20 -- it rolls so sweet -- and most other parts of the system are quite workable. I could quibble here and there, but all my other objections could be taken care of with a few minor house rules; but Hit Points are part of the deep code of the game, and you can't really change this feature without a nearly complete make-over.

[NPC Billybo]

Although, since you're here, let me run this by you:

Have you noticed that first level hit points don't make sense?

Monsters have their base hit points, which seem to be their natural, innate hit points, right? then if you add class levels, they add class-based hit points on top, right?

So why don't humans?

See, why do humans at first level have one hit die? Seems to me that all first level characters should be like monsters, in that they have both their natural/innate/untrained race/species based hit points, and then their level-based hit points ON TOP of that.

In other words, do zero level humans have zero hit points? Of course not. They must have some.

So, for example, humans might get a d10 for hit points at zero level (without any levels); dwarves the same; half-orcs d12; elves d8; gnomes and halflings d6.

So a first level human fighter would have d10+d10 hit points, a first level elf wizard d8 plus d4, etc. Whichever die is bigger, you take that at as its highest roll at first level.

This would help solve three problems simultaneously:

1) Characters would not be one-hit wonders, even at first level. Even a low hit point character like a halfling thief would have d6 (maxed) plus d6 hit points, or 7-12 hit points. That's usually enough to survive even max damage from most weapons.

2) In terms of consistency, the way that "normal races" gain hit points is the same as the way monsters do. You don't need that special rule for single-die monsters anymore like orcs, that says, if they have a character level, they exchange their normal hit die type for a class based hit die type. Instead, if goblins usually have d8 for a hit die, a goblin first level fighter would just have d8 plus d10 (or whatever).

3) It helps mitigate the exploding hit point problem, because first level fighters would have more hit points, and thus a fifth level fighter would have only 200% more hit dice than a first level figher (six compared to two) as opposed to the current system, where he has 400% hit dice (five compared to one).

[Dragen3]

I don't agree that D&D is a pretty poor way of doing things although the HP are definatly not a selling point.

[Bradford C. Walker]

Actually, they are a selling point and not for familiarity reasons.

[Dragen3]

Actually, they are a selling point and not for familiarity reasons. Why do you think this is so?

[Selim The Grim]

Y'know, I liked this thread a hell of a lot more when it wasn't a facile-yet-earnest retread of every other d20 flamethread.

[NPC Billybo]

With all due respect, I don't get something about you RPG guys.


I don't get how criticism of a system constitutes "flaming."

I go on line, I criticize movies, etc. People argue. But people are not so wrapped up in their personal consumer choices that they take criticism of their preferred products to be "flaming."

But you RPG guys... someone says a bad word about d20 and Hero (two systems I like, on the whole, but which I find fault with), and it's a "flamewar."

I've said it before, I'll say it again:

This hobby will never grow if the people currently in it do not exhibit more of the traits of mature, well-developed, non Simpons-Comic-Book-Guy adults.

[NPC Billybo]

Look, my bad on that for the accusatory, insulting tone.

I didn't really intend to insult you specifically, though of course that's exactly what I did. I'm sorry for that.
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