[AD&D 1e] Composite bows: am I missing something?

[The Grey Elf]

It seems that while they are somewhat more expensive than regular long- and short bows, composite long- and short bows have worse ranges and worse "To Hit vs. AC" bonuses, while dealing the same damage.

In effect, they're worse weapons that cost more. Am I missing something? Is there an advantage to a composite bow I've overlooked? I know in 3e "composite" was equated to "strength," but that wasn't the case in 1e, where a strength bow was a strength bow.

[Beckett]

I know in 3e "composite" was equated to "strength," but that wasn't the case in 1e, where a strength bow was a strength bow.

Are you sure? I thought there was some note floating around that only composite bows could be built for strength... maybe tucked away in the DMG? Could be I'm thinking of another edition, but it seems like 1e had something like it.

[The Grey Elf]

Are you sure? I thought there was some note floating around that only composite bows could be built for strength... maybe tucked away in the DMG? Could be I'm thinking of another edition, but it seems like 1e had something like it.

Not that I can find. The DMG just refers to strength bows as "strength bows."

However, if I can't find anything else, that's the ruling I'm going to implement, I think.

[BrokenShade]

I'm hazy, it's been a long time. But I think that is just the way it was back then.

The logic I seem to recall was that not all weapons were available everywhere. (Gasp!)

In historical terms (very vague here, and I could be horribly wrong) I think the longbow was fairly specific to Britain. The composite bows were more from the mongols etc, and were designed for shooting from horseback (longbows weren't).

So there may well have been no longbows available to you until you explored an area where creatures of some kind used them. Or alternatively, no composite bows.

Just my hazy <2c worth recollection. :)

[ENHenry]

It may be worth checking on Dragonsfoot or Knights 'n Knaves, but I think Gary, or someone in the know, said that the range figures and "hit vs. AC" charts were accidentally reversed, and proper errata is to swap them.

Thing is, errata wasn't as valued or as easy to release back then, so very few people have ever really seen the AD&D1 errata. Gary's work at TSR took on such a sacrosanct status (something I think he really disliked) among gamers, that people try to divine why certain things were the way they were, when it turns out they were simple editing errors.

[The Grey Elf]

It may be worth checking on Dragonsfoot or Knights 'n Knaves, but I think Gary, or someone in the know, said that the range figures and "hit vs. AC" charts were accidentally reversed, and proper errata is to swap them.

That was actually on the character sheets. They were in reversed order on the character sheets from the way they were presented in the book.

Thing is, errata wasn't as valued or as easy to release back then, so very few people have ever really seen the AD&D1 errata. Gary's work at TSR took on such a sacrosanct status (something I think he really disliked) among gamers, that people try to divine why certain things were the way they were, when it turns out they were simple editing errors.

No doubt. I believe that most of the errata for 1e was published in Dragon Magazine, but I'm not 100% on that.

[T. Foster]

Short (under 5' tall) characters can use composite long bows but not regular long bows. You can use a composite long bow but not a regular long bow while mounted.

[Deep One]

2E had the rule you could custom-build long bows to give you STR bonus on damage. In 1E, I too seem to recall you could use Composite Bows from horseback, but I can't remember if it was indeed in the rules or maybe just a houserule. Did you double-check with UA and OA? - Maybe you'll find additional information there?

[longcoat000]

Composite bows (short and long) allowed you to add your strength bonus to damage rolled, rather than taking the straight 1d6. I think they may have allowed you to use your to-hit bonus for strength instead of dexterity if you want, but I'm really hazy on it.

But adding strength to damage is definite.

[The Grey Elf]

Composite bows (short and long) allowed you to add your strength bonus to damage rolled, rather than taking the straight 1d6. I think they may have allowed you to use your to-hit bonus for strength instead of dexterity if you want, but I'm really hazy on it.

But adding strength to damage is definite.

Citation, please? Because I've NEVER seen that in a first edition game. Indeed, Strength bows always had a limit (i.e. strength bow +2 required a strength bonus of at least +2 to fire, and allowed you to add up to +2 to damage). There was never, so far as I can find, a rule about a bow that just allowed you (open ended) to add strength bonus...and it wasn't composite bows. Strength bows were listed as a type of weapon in the DMG.

[Canis Major]

I'm not sure, but it may have been in Unearthed Arcana.

[Beckett]

Citation, please? Because I've NEVER seen that in a first edition game. Indeed, Strength bows always had a limit (i.e. strength bow +2 required a strength bonus of at least +2 to fire, and allowed you to add up to +2 to damage). There was never, so far as I can find, a rule about a bow that just allowed you (open ended) to add strength bonus...and it wasn't composite bows. Strength bows were listed as a type of weapon in the DMG.

Unearthed Arcana doesn't appear to be anything. Going through the DMG, I see a reference to Strength Bonus Consideration on p 64, but there are no rules; if it's possible, the DM will let you know how to do it.

No rules to back this up (don't have access to a 1e PHB), but I know we typically played that composite bows could be used from horseback. I'm not sure this is ever stated in the rules, so might just be a house rule that was around so long we thought it was always there.

[One Star Under Heaven]

The price might just reflect the cost/difficulty of construction. Making a composite bow is more complicated than a long bow. There is also the issue that (checking Unearthed Arcana pdf) the price may reflect availability of a "foreign" weapon (i.e. one not typically found in medieval-type setting). A blowgun, for example, costs more than any type of sword but a two-handed sword.

[DestroyYouAlot]

No rules to back this up (don't have access to a 1e PHB), but I know we typically played that composite bows could be used from horseback. I'm not sure this is ever stated in the rules, so might just be a house rule that was around so long we thought it was always there.

IIRC, this is what was intended - whether that's from a book or some random Dragonsfoot Q&A, I couldn't say. 'Course, there's also the thing where you can let your composite bow get wet when your nice yew longbow will get destroyed... but then I probably use the Wilderness Survival Guide a little too much. LOL

[weasel fierce]

I dont recall any actual rules advantages. Don't think I ever had anyone use them much either. It was longbows or nothing :)