[4E] All divine party... fun?

[joenr76]

I just got my PHB2 and skimmed it a bit. I'm preparing a one - or two session game for 4-5 players. (With pregens)

And I was thinking about having a complete party have the same powersource. And Divine would probably make for the best adventure seeds. So before I work out the details of something like this, do you think that a party of 4 people playing divine heroes (1 for each role) be fun? And what characters (race-class combos) would you use? What about the 5th character?

Could the same be done for all power scources?

[Naxuul]

If you wanted to do Divine I would do:

Dragonborn Strength Paladin
Human Battle Cleric
Elven Pursuit Avenger
Deva Laser Cleric
Dwarven Wrath Invoker

You could also do Arcane or Primal easily. All Martial works as well, though no Controller and little ranged power there.

-Naxuul

[joenr76]

If you wanted to do Divine I would do:

Dragonborn Strength Paladin
Human Battle Cleric
Elven Pursuit Avenger
Deva Laser Cleric
Dwarven Wrath Invoker


As it happens, I had 4 of those as my 'probable' list. :D Deva laser Clerics is the missing one. Do your think that 2 clerics can be differen enough so the players don't mind having 2 of the same class?

Also, i think (knowing my players) that they prefer a second defender or striker as a fifth character.

As for an all Arcane party: i don't have the rules for the Arcane defender, who's name escapes me atm.

[Belphanior]

As for an all Arcane party: i don't have the rules for the Arcane defender, who's name escapes me atm.

Swordmage, from the Forgotten Realms player's guide.

[joenr76]

Swordmage, from the Forgotten Realms player's guide.

That's the one. Since FR is not the setting we will ever play, I haven't bought it. I'm holding out for Eberron (which we probably also won't play :o not anywhere soon, anyway, with 2 campaigns still going (DH and L5R))

[Atreios]

Do your think that 2 clerics can be differen enough so the players don't mind having 2 of the same class?
The Cleric IS two different classes sharing the same features.

[Brandon Schmelz]

All Martial works as well, though no Controller and little ranged power there.

-Naxuul

Wouldn't an Archer Ranger and ranged Rogue fix the ranged problem for Martial groups?
The Ranger alone adds a ton of ranged power.

[Omegatron]

All Divine is a Solar Exalted Circle, So Awesome I can't wait to try it.

Dawn - Paladin, multiclassed Warlord
Zenith - Cleric, multiclassed Warden
Twlighit - Invoker, multiclassed Artificer
Night - Avenger, multiclassed Fighter
Eclipse - Bard, multiclassed everything else



Maybe Dragonblooded where everyone played Genasi?

Air - Warlock [Fey], Druid, Artificer, Ranger or Rogue
Earth - Warden, Warlord, or Fighter
Fire - Swordmage or Sorcerer or Warlock
[I]Water - Rogue, Ranger, Sorcerer
Wood - Druid, Shaman, Warden, Ranger, Bard


All-Arcane becomes Sidereal?

Venus - Bard?
Mars - Swordmage?
Mercury - Sorcerer?
Jupiter - Wizard?
Saturn - Warlock [Star]?


All-Primal becomes, of course, Lunar? Where everyone plays Shifters, Half-Orcs, Dragonborn, Gnolls and Minotaurs?

Full Moon: Warden, Barbarian [Rageblood]
Changing Moon: Shaman [Bear], Barbarian [Thaneborn]
No Moon: Druid, Shaman [Panther]

[Mostlyjoe]

Ah yes. The Holy Roller's game. It can be loads of fun.

The 4E to Exalted conversion. Pure WIN!

[joenr76]

All Divine is a Solar Exalted Circle, So Awesome I can't wait to try it.

Dawn - Paladin, multiclassed Warlord
Zenith - Cleric, multiclassed Warden
Twlighit - Invoker, multiclassed Artificer
Night - Avenger, multiclassed Fighter
Eclipse - Bard, multiclassed everything else

That looks awesome :D Only the Bard is not really divine :)

[bigfluffylemon]

As it happens, I had 4 of those as my 'probable' list. :D Deva laser Clerics is the missing one. Do your think that 2 clerics can be differen enough so the players don't mind having 2 of the same class?

Also, i think (knowing my players) that they prefer a second defender or striker as a fifth character.


Yeah, laser clerics and battle clerics play very differently.

Build the battle cleric appropriately and you'll have a character capable of being a second defender as well as a leader. Takes a few feats (and eventually the warpriest paragon path), but it can be done.

Two avengers are likely to be very similar. If your players really want a second defender, a Str paladin with a 2-handed weapon, lots of Con and damage feats, and a Cha paladin with a shield, lots of wisdom and heals will probably play differently enough to be worth having.

(BTW - even if you're not playing FR you can still play a swordmage. IMO the class is fun, and almost worth picking up the FR book for. Almost, but not quite on its own. But if you got one between your group and shared it...)

[Emprint]

And I was thinking about having a complete party have the same powersource. And Divine would probably make for the best adventure seeds.

In 872, a crack crusader unit was excommunicated for a sin they did not commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security keep into the Shadowfell. Today, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, and no one else can help, maybe you can hire...

...The God Squad.

[joenr76]

Yeah, laser clerics and battle clerics play very differently.

Well, up 'till now one of my players is seriously in love with playing warlords, so I haven't seen a cleric in action yet.


(BTW - even if you're not playing FR you can still play a swordmage. IMO the class is fun, and almost worth picking up the FR book for. Almost, but not quite on its own. But if you got one between your group and shared it...)

I might borrow it from someone at my FLGS.

[joenr76]

In 872, a crack crusader unit was excommunicated for a sin they did not commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security keep into the Shadowfell. Today, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, and no one else can help, maybe you can hire...

...The God Squad.

:D

You forgot the soundeffects! (But I have no idea what fantasy crusaders would use instead of the machine gun noise.)

[Inyssius]

That's the one. Since FR is not the setting we will ever play, I haven't bought it. I'm holding out for Eberron (which we probably also won't play :o not anywhere soon, anyway, with 2 campaigns still going (DH and L5R))

You may wish to get it regardless; it does contain the entire non-setting-specific swordmage, the non-setting-specific Dark Pact warlock, the non-setting-specific genasi and drow, and a whole ton of feats.

(Erm, or pay seven dollars and get everything published to date, including Dungeon and Dragon material, in the Character Builder. That works too.)

[That Idiot]

In 872, a crack crusader unit was excommunicated for a sin they did not commit. These men promptly escaped from a maximum security keep into the Shadowfell. Today, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, and no one else can help, maybe you can hire...

...The God Squad.

Ha! One laugh point for you.

If the players use the option to just knock out instead of kill opponents reduced to zero hit points, you could even replicate the crazy fights wherein no one gets killed!

[Killfalcon]

That looks awesome :D Only the Bard is not really divine :)

No problem: make sure he has Wis13, and multiclass him into (all) the divine classes.

[Front Toward Everybody]

http://www.totalwallpapers.com/fantasy/wallpapers/army-of-undead.jpg

"Ah, FUCK!" It's that all-divine party again. Fucking hell. My Doctor told me I wasn't supposed to get, Turned, Rebuked, abjured, and basically melted into necrotic goo again for at least another week."

Keep this in mind when designing your encounters. Undead should only be used for physical comedy and to make the party feel badass. An all-divine party beats liches to death with a jar of turtle penises and laughs at them.

[DDogwood]

Back to the original question - yes, an all-Divine campaign would be fun, but not as much fun as one where other power sources were available too. It seems to me that not every character needs to have god-given divine magic powers, even in a campaign where all of the characters are employed by a religious organization. Fighters and Warlords could act in the service of almost any deity without having Divine powers or multiclass feats. Depending on the deity, Rangers, Rogues, or any of the Arcane classes would also be just as likely dedicated to a given deity as any Divine class. On top of this, the Primal classes could easily be reflavored to work with any nature-type deity (and Barbarians and Wardens would be great as followers of Kord, too).

So, I guess my question is - what do you gain from limiting the available classes to the Divine power source? As a player, I would much rather have the restriction "your character is one of the faithful of , choose your class and race accordingly" than "you have to play a Divine class".

In fact, I think an all-Divine party would be the most fun if the characters [i]didn't worship the same deity. There could be all kinds of interesting arguments about what is the best course of action in a given situation, and the Paladin could antagonize everyone with the "What Would Pelor Do?" sticker glued to his plate armor.

[joenr76]

Back to the original question - yes, an all-Divine campaign would be fun, but not as much fun as one where other power sources were available too. It seems to me that not every character needs to have god-given divine magic powers, even in a campaign where all of the characters are employed by a religious organization. Fighters and Warlords could act in the service of almost any deity without having Divine powers or multiclass feats. Depending on the deity, Rangers, Rogues, or any of the Arcane classes would also be just as likely dedicated to a given deity as any Divine class. On top of this, the Primal classes could easily be reflavored to work with any nature-type deity (and Barbarians and Wardens would be great as followers of Kord, too).

So, I guess my question is - what do you gain from limiting the available classes to the Divine power source? As a player, I would much rather have the restriction "your character is one of the faithful of , choose your class and race accordingly" than "you have to play a Divine class".

In fact, I think an all-Divine party would be the most fun if the characters [i]didn't worship the same deity. There could be all kinds of interesting arguments about what is the best course of action in a given situation, and the Paladin could antagonize everyone with the "What Would Pelor Do?" sticker glued to his plate armor.

For a longer campaign, I probably wouldn't be so restrictive, but it's only a one or 2 session game. So, I like it to be more focussed and get the 'how did the party meet and why do they stay together' out of the way.

[Scarik]

You could also do Arcane or Primal easily. All Martial works as well, though no Controller and little ranged power there.


You're kidding the new guy here, right?

The Ranger is the very definition of 'ranged power' no one hold a candle to its single target , ranged damage, and it can clear up minions and similar AoE proffered types. Back him up with a rogue built with a variety of ranged and melee powers and you have a fearsome party using just the 4 martial classes.

For an all Divine party its important to realize that the Cleric and Paladin are each 2 classes individually and 3 classes when combined (the Strength builds are very close to the same playstyle).

A Paladin or Cleric using strength and multi-classing into the other is a fun leader/defender, especially with Warpriest. Though a Cleric/fighter can do it nearly as well.

[joenr76]

You're kidding the new guy here, right?

I'm not really a 'new guy' :D I have ran a couple of sessions before and we have a pretty established group now for near to 20 years. I'm only 'new' to the PHB2 Races and those I haven't seen in play yet (Cleric and Warlock)

The reason we don't play D&D is that we're in the middle of a L5R campaign. We also have a 40k campaing waiting. So D&D is for filler weeks only, ATM.