Post originally by Blacksteel at 2003-05-18 10:23:16
Converted from Phorums BB System

What exactly needs to be defended? Believe it or not people can actually discuss things on forums.I wasn't aware anything needed to be defended.Why would it need to be defended? Well, quit saying it's wrong to complain about the price then. That's a general consensus for the book. The SJ review from their Pyramid zine said the same thing about the price. Over all it was a pretty positive review. You should make a effort and read it.

---> Just pointing out that this isn't a rabid-fan reaction, and it's not particularly this game. I disagree with the idea that quality is measured by page count, which is at the heart of the "$30 for 144 pages is too much" argument. If it's a good game, it's worth $30. If it sucks, it's not. The page count is not a factor here.



Well it seems to me almost everyone said the price is a little high. Even on the general forum if you would have read it.

---> Mostly from people who haven't looked at it, I might guess? They're looking at page count & price, they're not evaluating the game.


>>>I walk into the game store, I see a sea of hardbacks for $25-$45.>>>>>>>>

So what. That's a gimmie.

---> Well, judging by what other rpg books cost, I'd say it's right in line then. It's not outside the range of usual prices. It's not particularly high or low. It's right there. So it's not "overpriced".

>>>Then, the original reviewer fails to mention what he thought it _should_ have cost. If $30 is too high, what's the right price?>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Like I said. What's the point? It's not up to me or you. Shane needs to charge a little higher price because of his company situation. He's already stated that.

---> The point is that if you think $30 is too high, you probably have some idea of what it should cost IYO. If, as you say, most people think it's overpriced, then maybe Shane needs to know what people would consider fair. Maybe future books need to be softcover, or longer. If the price for length thing is affecting sales then it's an issue.

Mostly I ask because I suspect the original complaint was mostly whining, not something that was thought out, and most likely by someone who had not even seen the book. They just looked at the numbers in the review and reacted. If there's anything that's tough to judge on numbers alone, as in pages-per-dollar, I nominate RPGs.

But it does go back to everything from basic economics, "charge what the market will bear", to marketing - price points, undercutting the competition or positioning your brand as a premium brand. Pricing is important, as this thread has illustrated, so why can't someone throw a price out there?

So $29.95 is too high. How about $28.95? $27.95? Eventually we might find out what "most people" think is the right price for a 144 page B&W RPG Hardback. I'm sure future publishers would thank us : )


So now discussing aspects of a product line is now whining. You are a real hoot. You make me laugh.Shane seems pretty cool with the constructive criticism that SW has been getting. Believe it or not it's healthy. No one is saying that it's not a good game. It seems to me you are taking things on the personal level. I'm sorry you seem to feel that way.

---> The original post was "discussing aspects of a product line" in much the same way as the classic "The art sucks", "The rules suck", or even "The margins are too wide." All complaints are not constructive criticism. If the poster said "I think it's over priced _because_" then it might turn into constructive criticism.

It's hardly personal. I bought the game, but I have no emotional investment in it specifically. I've bought a lot of games. I rarely post here. This particlar outburst was just a rare confluence of a dumb statement made on something I do know about that I thought should not go unchallenged.

Most of the discussion has been pretty good. Heck, we even managed to draw Shane into telling us exactly why it costs what it costs. That's rare from any publisher, so kudos to us and to him.

Blacksteel