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Originally Posted by Harlequins_Back
Then why is it that whenever I point out that the game does have a solid base, but needs improvement, I get declared a "nSR Hater" by Fanpro writers?
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As someone who has been targetted by fans before and accused of being a unisystem hater in the past, I appreciate what you are saying. However, a lot of what you have said does suggest a bias against Shadowrun 4th that goes beyond anything in the publication. I've pointed out why I feel this bias exists. Further, I have not seen any of the writers come up and accuse you of being an "nSR Hater" on these forums.
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Including yours, there are four reviews of nSR currently on RPG.net-- so, seventy-five percent of reviewers are mentioning how the game does not feel the same, how the mechanics are good but need work, and that character creation is a mess. There's no reason to start insulting and flaming all the other reviewers because our opinions differ from yours-- our opinions are at least as well grounded in the actual product as your own, as many of the other reviews do go heavily into the actual mechanics.
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Edit: I think I was a bit on the verge of snarky on this one. My point is that this isn't a competition. I gave the game a 5/5 and I stand by that claim. I have not insulted anyone. I have stated that I feel the other reviewers have less reviewed the game as much as look for reasons to say why they dislike it rather than admitting that they just wanted something closer to the older shadowrun. That's perfectly valid. But their critiques are not. They don't match with the physical product, in my opinion.
There are not nearly as many issues with the system as are claimed. I have, I feel, successfully refuted all the system claims put forward on these forums. The layout is not a problem either, and I have shown why.
You claim your opinions are grounded in the actual product - but I've already shown a better knowledge of the layout and location of rules than you have managed to. If your opinions were so factually grounded I shouldn't be able to refute them so easily. There would need to be more of a grey area. But the reality is that the book
is well referenced and indexed. Which means that there is no puzzle piecing involved - unless the reader is not looking at the page references or index. I do know of a number of gamers who do this. But that doesn't make the book any less well referenced.
You have complained about systems without presenting any actual mechanical or factual proof to back up those claims.
I have gone into very clear detail about the system to present what makes it streamlined and simple. I have successfully refuted all your claims to the contrary regarding both the Wireless and Ranged. So much so that you had to resort to semantics to try and counter my argument.
Shadowrun deserves the score I gave it. I'm sorry if you don't like the fact that I feel a score of 5/5 can be given to a game that is less than the writings of divinity, but I measure games on what I feel to be a reasonably objective and realistic scale.
I say reasonably because I won't deny my biases. I had a hugely successful playtest of the game and that was central in my final scoring. The point is that I ran a playtest with fresh players, only myself having read the book once that same day, with no preparation or planning - and it was a roaring success mechanically and playwise.
As far as I'm concerned any game that pulls that off is going to rank highly straight away. The quality of the writing and the layout helped keep the score high, and so when I finally sat down and considered all the elements and the fact that
I had absolutely nothing negative to say about the game other than some of the art wasn't that great and some of the fiction was a bit dull I felt that as a
game as well as a product it earned a 5/5.
Learn to live with it. I'm not backing down. The only negative experience I have had with SR4 is your dogged determination to try and say that I'm wrong for choosing to give it 5/5. That's not going to happen. Fanpro earned that score fair and square. It deserves that score and I will continue to highly recommend it to anyone who is interested in the game.
Conan