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Originally Posted by mxyzplk
Well, this is what I'm afraid the line of reasoning is, and the thing is it doesn't make any sense. With the one exception of RPGA organized play, which is utilized only by the vast, vast minority of gamers, who plays "pick-up D&D"? And more importantly, who wants to?
Saying that D&D should become more like MMORPGs in this sense because MMORPGs are more "with it" contains a horrible logical fallacy. Not every aspect of MMORPGs is good per se - some of them are "necessary evils" of their implementation. As a L64 priest in WoW, I would say that the strict role division in WoW is a necessary evil of the huge distributed aspect of MMORPGs.
D&D could certainly learn some things from WoW, but it's important that it look carefully and learn the good lessons and not the bad ones.
If you look at the problem carefully, you'll see all the differences. In WoW, if you need a pick up group, you need people around your level. Characters have to be grown up to that level. In D&D there's a time-honored solution, which is just build a level whatever character. That's not allowed in MMORPGs.
It seems a weak contention that "these kids nowadays" are demanding some larger pick-up style of game creation. You still need a prepared DM, characters around the same level, etc. The only format in which that works as "pick-up" is the Living campaigns where you can get a critical mass of prepared DMs and loads of PCs together. As a former LG Triad, I can say that format does not require LESS, but MORE effort and planning, and adding "character roles" will have nothing to do with that.
Playing "chase the MMORPG" will be a losing strategy. They have more and more skilled developers and money to realize their visions. It's better to analyze where tabletop has advantages over MMOs and to maximize those.
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I largely agree with you, my point was primarily that the RPG landscape has changed and the environment in which D&D 4.0 is being introduced is different than that of earlier versions.
I began playing RPGs before they existed on computers. It wasn't until I got my hands on a Commodore 64 and a copy of Ultima 4 that a lightbulb clicked that it was possible to play a fantasy "role-playing" game on a computer. However, I still played tabletop D&D heavily because that was a much more rewarding experience than playing a solo game with "close-ended" gameplay possibilities.
So my role-playing foundation was that I played tabletop RPGs
first, and see computer RPGs as a "simulation" of "the real thing."
However, today's generation of gamers are cutting their teeth on computer RPGs. Depending on how far back you go, you might have started with the gold box games, or Baldur's Gate, or World of Warcraft.
So, while my generation of gamers might say that "World of Warcraft is kinda like D&D, except on the computer", this generation of gamers might say, "D&D is like World of Warcraft, except without the computer."
Todays future D&D 4.0 players are likely starting with a baseline of what they have experience in an MMO. There are certain character role expectations that they have. There are certain character conventions that they expect to be there because their foundation of gaming is based on MMO conventions.
I think the "logic" that D&D 4.0 is following is that they want to make the game as accessible and played by as many people as possible. If they succeed in that, then they make a lot of money and retain their position as the grandfather of RPG gaming and the de-facto tabletop RPG.
The trick is to "steal" gamers away from today's RPG gaming medium (CRPGs and MMOs) and introduce them to the (superior, IMO) experience of playing a tabletop role-playing game. The second trick is to publish a game that doesn't piss off all of the forum jockeys and cause a lot of negative word of mouth that will scare away potential tabletop gamers.
Where we saw computer role-playing as a restriction on what we did on the tabletop, today's generation needs to see that the horizons are wider by stepping away from the computer.