Post originally by Lord Liaden at 2003-09-15 11:32:06
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Calling this review "capsule" is a bit like calling Godzilla a "big lizard," but I compliment you on covering this massive tome thoroughly, informatively and entertainingly. Your review conveys a clear idea of what's in FH and what it does. I like that you could discuss your perceived flaws in the book but also offer constructive suggestions for improvement, while still coming down strongly in favor of FH as a whole.
Post originally by Samurai at 2003-09-15 15:49:04
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Good review, though I'd disagree on the ratings... I'd give 5 for Substance (honestly, how could anyone not??), but only a 3 for style. I found it to be rather dry reading, and I feel that some parts of it are just too crunchy (sectional armor) while other parts didn't do enough to differentiate items (like armor and weapon types, many of which have nearly identical stats). Still, for the price, it is worth getting if you want to use Hero to run Fantasy, though I miss the Spell Colleges of 4th ed...
Post originally by Keneton at 2003-09-15 16:13:54
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I suppose their is a better system EZ? A system that allows you to do anything? A sytem that can cover all of the different sub genres of fantasy?
Oh wise one enlighten us.
That is the problem with boards like this. People make negative staemnets but they do not back it up with substance.
You are entitled to dislike the HERO system. Just say why. Infering that it is archaic seems silly to me. Its what you want it to be. You say it is out of touch with Modern Fantasy. . .Give an example of why. What modern fantasy are we talking about? What game or game sytem is in touch? Why is it better?
Post originally by Ian Noble at 2003-09-15 17:31:05
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I think that EZ is saying that bigger doesn't necessarily equal better which is what the reviewer seems to be embracing.
I can think of Pendragon as a fantasy game much better suited of evoking the feel of Arthurian fantasy. Ditto for Lord of the Rings rpg and low-magic worlds such as Middle-earth. Ditto for Nobilis and lyrical modern fantasy. They just have more flash and chrome that feels like the genre.
Just because the game is massive doesn't make it better -- not by a long shot. I'm tired of this fallacy and I think that EZ doesn't want others to fall into that kind of thinking. I've been seeing this logic on the forum with regards to other games, too. (the Stargate rpg suddenly comes to mind) The user doesn't necessarily need to learn programming if there's an application already out there that does what they want more elegantly. Hero is the programming code and is great if you want that. But many people, me among, are looking for software.
EZ -- you're on the right track, whoever the hell you are. Just do the straffing run a bit more precisely next time...
Yamo -- I'm not trying to start a flame war. You have every right to defend the game you love. No one should be attacking the fact that you like it.
Post originally by Lord Liaden at 2003-09-15 18:06:54
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If you look at EZ's remarks, you'll note that he says nothing negative about the book's size. He simply characterizes it as "archaic" and "out of touch with modern fantasy," and complains about the slowness with which you can build worlds in HERO. All very offhandedly dismissive.
The book is indeed massive, and that may be off-putting to some people. Fair enough. It's massive because it tries (and IMHO mostly succeeds) to cover the whole realm of fantasy subgenres, and give gamers the tools to play any of them. It definitely does demand more effort from the GM than a pre-made setting, and you're within your rights if that isn't your cup of tea (although Hero Games is working on putting out those, too).
I'm of the opinion that no generic game can simulate a particular setting or style as well as a well-crafted game aimed at that setting. Pendragon is great for Arthurian romance, LoTR for low magic, etc. But they're multiple games using mutiple systems or system variants. HERO markets itself as one system that lets you do any of them, nearly as well as the narrowly-focussed games (again IMHO), as well as combine elements of different subgenres and allow characters from them to cross between these worlds.
Post originally by Yamo at 2003-09-15 18:24:40
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"I think that EZ is saying that bigger doesn't necessarily equal better which is what the reviewer seems to be embracing."
Not at all. I did comment on the book's size only because it was in fact, very, very large. So much so that any discussion of its physical aspects would be remiss without mentioning such. There are a few other references to the length of particular sections or chapters, just for the sake of description and to give the reader an idea as to how different sections of the book compare to one another length-wise.
Point of fact: The parts of FH that are good are good because they're good.
Post originally by Roy Morgan at 2003-09-15 18:38:37
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"It's also more archaic and out of date with modern (fantasy) sensibilities than God. "
"But God does seem to move faster, you couldn't put together a world in 7 days with the HERO system."
Hey, this is a GENERIC fantasy rules system. No, it won't build worlds in seven days. But most of the buyers are picking up this book because they're planning on spending a considerable amount of time building the world that they have in mind. HERO is slow, true, but it's very thorough if you understand how to use it.
As for archaic, the same could be said of D&D and the Palladium Fantasy RPG, which have essentially had the same system for 25 years or so now. Sure, both have been updated, but they're still the same stumbling, wheezing systems that have been out there since the '70's! What makes Fantasy HERO any worse than that?
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