Nicely rendered PDF download of the popular top banana all-purpose space/fantasy/politics sci-fi. A setting that takes in your favourite SF cliches and an elegant and fast system make for a fun game.
Post originally by Pierce Inverarty at 2004-09-10 06:43:04
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Great review. Like FS, you covered all the bases, and you didn't forget the less-than-spectacular bits either (i.e., every single alien race). I'm myself puzzled by FS's central riddle: not why the suns are fading, but rather why, given the setting is so eclectic, FS doesn't fall apart. Because, as you say, it simply doesn't--for some reason, FS is a game world with a marvellously consistent feel, namely, Dune Plus X. By rights, that shouldn't work, but it does.
Post originally by Tim Gray at 2004-09-10 09:21:50
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Yeah, good review.
I've got some FS on my shelf in the "run it someday" camp. The thing that really appeals to me is the picture of the jumpweb (the network of available routes between jumpgates; each has connections to only a few others) and the opportunities for exploring that it suggests. This got a small kick recently from watching the Firefly DVD... the idea of a small crew in a small ship cruising round...
Post originally by Jack Holcomb at 2004-09-10 09:39:57
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I second that "you nailed it" and add a "Dude." Nicely done.
Pierce Inverarty wrote:
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Like FS, you covered all the bases, and you didn't forget the less-than-spectacular bits either (i.e., every single alien race).
FS aliens are certainly more of the Star Trek/Babylon 5 guy-in-a-rubber-mask variety than they are like the Eber, Kafers, K'kree, Hivers, etc--the really truly great alien species created by the old GDW staff for their games. And the FS aliens are patchily described in the main book.
But I don't really mind rubber-mask aliens. They're fun and they have their function--condensing particular (human) traits or presenting a particular cross-section of (human) culture and behavior.
Pierce I. further said:
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I'm myself puzzled by FS's central riddle: not why the suns are fading, but rather why, given the setting is so eclectic, FS doesn't fall apart. Because, as you say, it simply doesn't--for some reason, FS is a game world with a marvellously consistent feel, namely, Dune Plus X. By rights, that shouldn't work, but it does.
I think of Fading Suns in a category with Deadlands--both seem to be RPGs self-consciously designed to tie together varied pop culture sources in an internally consistent, pleasing way. They're patchworks, but they're particularly lovely patchworks.
One quibble with the article:
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Interstellar politicking, with guilds, church sects and noble houses like in Dune? Check.
Galactic fundamentalist jyhads and star-spanning barbarian hordes, like in Dune? Check.
Psychic powers, like in (wait for it) Dune? Check.
With ya on the first two, but I have to part ways on the last one. Herbert didn't include psychic powers (as they are conventionally understood) in Dune; he did include abilities that were tremendous extensions of real human capabilities, like the BG ability to interpret your cognitive processes based on minute observation, and their further ability to pitch their voices in just such a way as to provoke your obedience, and their further ridiculous levels of self control--but the BG couldn't just read your mind and mentally dominate you; and like the mentat's savant-like computative ability--but the mentats couldn't just remotely view events far away; and like the Face Dancers' feature-contorting muscular control--but the Face Dancers couldn't just shapeshift any old way; and like the Guild Navigators' ability to astronavigate (very akin to the mentat's maths abilities). While these abilities LOOKED like magic to the uninitiated in the Dune-iverse, Herbert was always pretty careful to ground them (at least a little) in real human faculties. About the most radical speculation he makes in the direction of psychic powers is the idea of genetic memory, which still doesn't go that far. Even the Kwisatz Haderach's precognitive ability winds up being a combination of BG and mentat awareness, and a dose of the genes necessary to unlock a certain chunk of genetic memory by becoming a male Reverend Mother. That is, precognition is what Asimov called psychohistory, except all the extrapolation is done in the user's head.
(This is of course the part of Herbert that all adaptations have screwed up to one degree or another. I only read the first two of Kevin Anderson/Brian Herbert's new Dune books, so I can't really speak to their treatment of this issue in any depth--but given how hard they were working to mess up the elder Herbert's cool universe, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if they made the BG full-on psychics.)
FS includes a lot of the same abilities as Dune, but frames them mystically, NOT as developments in the sciences of human potential (with a mystical overlay for the rubes). Is this a distinction without a difference? I think it makes a big difference in the tone of the FS universe--which is a HAUNTED universe, a universe with cthulhoid nasties out in the depths of space. Dune is a universe where feudalism and neo-medievalism has been imposed on humanity, and where mysticism is used to manipulate the credulous. FS is a universe where feudalism and medievalism is actually the natural order, where mysticism is real, and where humanism (from the Enlightenment through the Second Republic) is painted as an aberration. There are occasional nods in FS toward the idea that all this mysticism is a mistaken understanding of what are really just 1) psychic phenomena and 2) encounters with exotic critters, probably of extradimensional origin, but the setting doesn't really encourage that reading of things.
Post originally by Wood at 2004-09-10 10:15:01
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Thanks for the props, lads.
Jack Holcomb wrote:
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<i>With ya on the first two, but I have to part ways on the last one. Herbert didn't include psychic powers (as they are conventionally understood) in Dune; he did include abilities that were tremendous extensions of real human capabilities[...] </i>
OK, fair point. It's been a while since I read Dune (I only read the first three, though), but yes, you're right, now I come to think of it.
Anyone read Christopher Moeller's Iron Empires comics? Dark Horse reissued them as graphic novels earlier this year and there was supposed to be an RPG from Avalanche. They fit really well into the Fading Suns milieu.
Post originally by Dan Davenport at 2004-09-10 10:23:28
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Yup, excellent job on the review.
Does the 2nd edition include actual information on demons and Antimony, though? If not, my one minor quibble with the review is that while such things are definitely part of the setting, they aren't supported by the core book alone.
Post originally by dulahan at 2004-09-10 10:34:57
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Your fears are unfounded, other than in the War in the Heavens Adventure/supplements. There is no metaplot to speak of. Yes, there are a few things with each new book bringing you up to date but there is no actual metaplot in the White Wolf Sense. You can use the information just as easily in the latest books back in the timeframe as the early books.
Post originally by jay verkuilen at 2004-09-10 12:50:15
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dulahan wrote:
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>>Your fears are unfounded, other than in the War in the Heavens Adventure/supplements. There is no metaplot to speak of. Yes, there are a few things with each new book bringing you up to date but there is no actual metaplot in the White Wolf Sense. You can use the information just as easily in the latest books back in the timeframe as the early books.<<
I totally concur. Dulahan beat me to the post. There is no appreciable metaplot and what there is can safely be ignored because very little of any consequence happens in it. There is a series of adventure books which have a plot (duh but nothing heavy at all.
I ran Fading Suns from '96 to about '99 and had a lot of fun with it. My interests have gone in different directions (and I've not GMed anything regularly in a few years) but it's an old favorite and I own nearly all the books.
Post originally by jay verkuilen at 2004-09-10 12:58:24
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These are a bit of a bone of contention among fans and were often chewed over on the Fading Suns mailing list (which is still going after all these years).
Having run the game extensively, I found I never really "grokked" them. I really dug the simplicity of the one die roll but it tended to give really random results that were often frustrating to the players. Many people's mileage most certainly varied, however. Were I to run it again today I'd use Adventure!-vintage Storyteller or Star Wars D20. A lot of Fading Suns people liked the Fading Suns D20 conversion but I like the Wound point/Vitality point distinction better than the D&D3 based rule set.
but nothing heavy at all.
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