Two games enter; one game leaves. My review compares the 1st and 2nd editions of Warhammer Fantasy Roleplaying (WFRP) to see which is the greatest. Hopefully, you don’t need to have read either edition to get something out of this review.
Post originally by Oddsod at 2005-05-02 03:07:05
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Fans of the wargame can easily use their knowledge of the game world in the roleplaying game. Also, the game world is left open enough for history buffs to bring in information as they see fit - some may want to leave the game world as-is, others will want to bring more detail to the game world and crank up the realism insofar as is possible for a fantasy game. When I get the Bestiary and maybe GM screen I'll probably be back with more.
Post originally by orangefruitbat at 2005-05-02 07:01:39
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Yes, IF you play WFB, you can bring in all sorts of things. But, lots of people don't play WFB (including me), or were introduced to WFRP before WFB. Furthermore, what attracted me (and others) to WFRP was the gritty and historical setting with a touch of high fantasy. WFB has all sorts of silliness that I defintely don't want in my rpg. (In all fairness to Green Ronin/Black Industries, the truly outrageous parts of WFB are not present in 2nd edition WFRP).
Yes, you can write your own background, but I like WFRP for the background. Let's face it. 1st edition, for all its faults, managed to put in tons of world info, making it a nearly complete book. 2nd edition, for all its shiny newness, lacks a lot of background info and campaign support (monsters, magic items, etc). With 1st edition, I didn't feel that I needed a Beastiary (though I probably would have picked one up if it came out). In these respects, the new edition comes up short.
Oddsod wrote:
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Fans of the wargame can easily use their knowledge of the game world in the roleplaying game. Also, the game world is left open enough for history buffs to bring in information as they see fit - some may want to leave the game world as-is, others will want to bring more detail to the game world and crank up the realism insofar as is possible for a fantasy game. When I get the Bestiary and maybe GM screen I'll probably be back with more.
Post originally by Sedenya at 2005-05-02 08:24:52
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I don't have my 1e WFRP book with me, but I recall I didn't ever use the OLDENHALLER CONTRACT because it worked not very well in conjunction with THE ENEMY WITHIN campaign. IIRC it took place in Nuln, which is far off the Altdorf area, in which TEW starts, and for my tastes it did involve so many contacts with chaos and horrible events, that the tentative beginnings of TEW did not really work anymore, especially since the characters won't be 0-level-starters anymore.
If the Draken Wald-scenario in the 2e book does a better job with the upcoming campaign, I'd favor this over the old one.
As standalone though, I must wait 'til I've read the new rulebook.
Post originally by Wes Johnson at 2005-05-02 08:25:29
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I have always been sort of interested in the Warhammer fantasy rpg but never really got around to checking out either edition. I really appreciated your great compare and contrast review filled with specific details in both new and old mechanics, setting and character materials.
It seems to me that many of the defecits you speak of seem likely to be covered in supplements, but I guess that is sort of a detriment compared to the first edition which appears to have more setting material. Good for an initial start, but supplements can offer much more material...albeit it later on. Hopefully this will not lead to the d20 issue of cool new character stuff coming out after a the base game has been released and players already set on their development course...
Post originally by orangefruitbat at 2005-05-02 08:36:54
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I never had any problems making the transition from the Odenhaller Contract to TEW, mostly because my players always managed to get chased or kicked out of Nuln pretty quickly - they pretty much are guaranteed to offend at least one thieves guild, an evil cult, and a powerful civic official. From there, it's pretty easy to put them on the road to Altdorf (and thereby start TEW). And they're really up only 1 or 2 advances over a newbie character, so XP isn't too big a problem (though it rapidly becomes a problem, given how quickly advancement can occur in v.1 WFRP).
As for your complaint that the scenario introduces chaos cultists too quickly, well that's a matter of taste. I didn't have a problem with this (and the Nurgle cults are very different from the Tzeench cults encountered later). Overall, there probably are too many chaos cults encountered in the published WFRP adventures.
I just really didn't like TTD. There really isn't much for the players to do, and they're not dramatically connected to the NPCs at all. I'm sure it could be fleshed out, given some extra GM work, but it doens't seem all that interesting out of the box. I have no idea on how well it leads into Ashes of Middenheim, since AOM isn't out yet.
Sedenya wrote:
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I don't have my 1e WFRP book with me, but I recall I didn't ever use the OLDENHALLER CONTRACT because it worked not very well in conjunction with THE ENEMY WITHIN campaign. IIRC it took place in Nuln, which is far off the Altdorf area, in which TEW starts, and for my tastes it did involve so many contacts with chaos and horrible events, that the tentative beginnings of TEW did not really work anymore, especially since the characters won't be 0-level-starters anymore.
If the Draken Wald-scenario in the 2e book does a better job with the upcoming campaign, I'd favor this over the old one.
As standalone though, I must wait 'til I've read the new rulebook.
Post originally by lysanderus at 2005-05-02 09:14:13
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honestly, much of the background information for Warhammer's setting is all in the public eye. It's to Games Workshop's advantage to make the fluffy background information as public as possible to keep up interest, so they don't do too much to squelch it.
A little tooling around the internet will provide lots of background information, in addition to flipping through some of the wargame suppliments. I think anyone who's going to take the time to pick up the book is probably going to notice the wall full of Games Workshop stuff right next to it, and realize that they're probably dealing with a rich setting.
Even barring all that sort of ingenuity, it would have been nice if they'd pointed out that the setting has existed for a long time, and there can be a lot of information found with a little research.
Personally, I like the vagueness of the setting. I like the fact that putting the setting together requires you to have a broad knowledge of resources, and that when you're putting the setting together it's tentative at best. There are very few definitive "facts" you just piece together the bits you find here and there and try to make sense of it all.
Post originally by Nathanael at 2005-05-02 09:16:15
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I agree that the Oldenhaller Contract is the far superior adventure, but given the space restraints of the new rulebook, the Drakwald is a good starting point.
As for blending in TEW with TOC, I never had a problem because my PC's all invariably ended up so wounded or infected with the rot that they decided to retire those charcters and start again!
You might say I really enjoyed the gritty nature of the world, as did the players, but I also owned the Lost and the Damned book so my Nurgle Cultists were a tad more deadly... ; P
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