Inspired by this Gaming Gatherings thread inviting people to a Tekumel game, it occurred to me and Casey777 that many GMs are put off running games in "difficult" settings, and players from playing them.
A "difficult" setting is, in this context, one which is very complex and rich in detail. Its complexity and richness of detail make it very attractive to GMs and some players, but it also puts off players new to it. They wonder if they have to read a whole novel to be able to play.
Examples of "difficult" settings might be Tekumel, Harn (like, how do I type the ^ doohickey over the a, eh?), and in some respects Middle Earth and Transhuman Space, Blue Planet, or Traveller. Players are attracted by the richness and complexity, but they're also put off by it.
What sort of settings have people found to be "difficult," and what sort of solutions have you come up with to be able to recruit players to your group for it? What did you do to make it easier for players new to the setting? What did you, as a player, find made it particularly easy or difficult?
This is intended as a general query about "difficult settings", rather than about this or that setting specifically. I especially don't want to turn it into a "bash setting X" thread I think all of these settings offer great opportunities for interesting games. It's just that they're a bit daunting for newbies to them...
Hold Alt, press 131, release Alt. Or copy-and-paste it.
And now you know.
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I agree people tend to be put off by difficult settings. I think the best fix is to abstract out - just because the detail is there doesn't mean it has to be used. Introduce new elements slowly, a few at a time and giving the players a chance to understand things. Eventually they'll be full experts in the setting.
For the GM the situation is more difficult, because they really do need to at least be aware of most of the elements of a setting before they try and run it. This goes double if any of the players already knows the setting.
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Warhammer Fantasy Role Play fits into the catagory.
I've tried giveing the players some advenced information, but that usually puts them off more as they realize it's going to be "work" to play in this setting.
The best "complicatted" settings are ones like Paranoia, where the PCs knowing nothing is better. (IMHO).
Otherwise, I'm more for "generic" settings, in the end everyone has more fun.
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Inspired by this Gaming Gatherings thread inviting people to a Tekumel game, it occurred to me and Casey777 that many GMs are put off running games in "difficult" settings, and players from playing them.
A "difficult" setting is, in this context, one which is very complex and rich in detail. Its complexity and richness of detail make it very attractive to GMs and some players, but it also puts off players new to it. They wonder if they have to read a whole novel to be able to play.
Examples of "difficult" settings might be Tekumel, Harn (like, how do I type the ^ doohickey over the a, eh?), and in some respects Middle Earth and Transhuman Space, Blue Planet, or Traveller. Players are attracted by the richness and complexity, but they're also put off by it.
What sort of settings have people found to be "difficult," and what sort of solutions have you come up with to be able to recruit players to your group for it? What did you do to make it easier for players new to the setting? What did you, as a player, find made it particularly easy or difficult?
I’d add Jorune and tentatively Glorantha.
I think also the perceived “difference” of these settings can be a factor. Another difficulty with these settings is just how big they are, in range, in detail, and oftentimes in physical area.
What I’ve found is to give the setting hooks in your presentation (pitch) to player and in running games and to parcel out material in digestible portions. By hooks I mean things that make a character alive, goals, ties, ads/disads, parts of the setting, and so forth. Things the player might be interested in playing or that could make the setting entertaining.
So have ready a handful of hooks while narrowing the overall focus. To help a player grab onto the setting, find something they can identify with or at least understand, and get “into” some aspect of the setting and their character that they find interesting and fun. Not too many hooks and be ready to adapt them on the fly to each player or else you’re back to too much info and no “ground” to start from.
Also as a potential GM for a game being enthused about and comfortable with a setting really goes a long way. Regardless of how much of the setting the GM has absorbed if that spark is going and the ideas are flowing it will come out in the pitch for the campaign and in the running as well. Good presentation of the setting in the gaming materials helps here. Manners, confidence, and patience also.
Personally the difficulties I’ve had with settings like the above boil down to “where do I begin?” and “what can I do?” either as a GM or a player. Such a setting can overwhelm me, esp. if not familiar with the subjects the setting covers or any inspirations it may have had.I know I still have a bit of this with Transhuman Space and I had this with Tekumel until the latest rules. Also effective use of art to help get concepts across and additional material (fiction, online sites, downloads, maps, etc.) can help bring the setting to life and make it easier to grasp.
FYI...If you don't have the keys on your keyboard and you have windows os go to programs>accessories>system tools>character map and you get a window with all those cool little goodies that you can copy and paste or it'll show you the key strokes
Including these fun little thingys:
Warhammer Fantasy Role Play fits into the catagory.
I'd disagree with that. WFRP is a great example of a setting that is very easy to get into, but has lots of subtleties to explore. Well, if you've ever read Pratchett or seen Blackadder it is.
The thing with complex settings is much the same as the deal with comlpex systems, which was discussed in the "D20 GMs how do you do it" thread. You need to understand your setting well, and be prepared to work hard to communicate it. That means preparation beforehand, and work during the game as well.
Generally, a good rule of thumb is to look at how writers introduce complex settings to readers. Tolkein does some things right (his central characters, like the audience, know almost nothing about their world) but other things wrong (and now, Gandalf will explain history for nine fucking pages). Star Trek uses its episodic nature to focus on single events, with every aspect about that event explained and contained within that episode (well, for a while). TV shows establish their mythos through episodes; it's a good idea to do the same with RPGs. Players lurrrrve to have a "game mythos", and will remember twists and turns of their characters and their settings; it's up to you to worm the setting into that.
Unfortunately, a LOT of settings make this difficult, because there aren't any easy or obvious ways to make the players ignorant. WFRP, Cthulhu, Buffy - these all work well. Tekumel, HAAAARN, Blue Planet and THS, much less so. It is extremely difficult for players, too, to really roleplay someone who has grown up in a vastly different mental universe from what we can know or see.
Some games get around this with the middle ground - Blue Planet is high-tech (Earth is much like it is in THS), but on the frontier tech is slowed down so things are much closer to our time. Ars Magica is centred in the medieval paradigm, but the mages live apart, with advanced ideas of democracy and socialism and enlightenment, making them easier to play. Vampire concentrates on the lower generations, who are more human and less bestial. And so on.
Generally, my solution is "don't play those games". But I'm considering a BP game soon.
I think all of these settings offer great opportunities for interesting games. It's just that they're a bit daunting for newbies to them...
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