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[BLUE PLANET] Wait. There's a Third Edition Coming Out?

MichaelSD

Silver Dragon
Validated User
Tags? Are they anywhere near as central to the game as in Fate or Redemption? Because if so, that's an immediate and hard no-sell for me unless I buy it just for setting material. (And I could already use my V2 books for that just as well.)
Central is relative to one's taste. Compared to Fate, they are definitely not central. You can even play without them if you are bothered by them. I find them nifty, because they are easy to understand and simple to use. They are simple attributes modifiers.
  1. Tags are something inherent to the character acquired during adventures (-+1 to -+4). Like missing little finger giving -1 ot Dexterity sometimes, amnesia, personality trait. Etc.
  2. Tracks specific mental or physical state (-2 to +2). They are campaign or party specific, like Family, Squad Members, Bravery (I think a Call of Cthulhu game would have Sanity as a track for example). From the adventure: RED SKY CHARTERS : Lifeblood of the company +2/-2; Sweat and tears +1/-1; We’ve got this! 0/0; I’ve had it up to the gills! -1/+1; Screw it! I’m out! -2/+2
  3. Ties are connection, which have a condition/resonsibility and a punishment for not doing that. Example of one NPC from the adventure: GORSHKOV FAMILY. Must loyally follow orders ■ Executed and dumped in the ocean. On top of my had another one would be GEO Soldier: obey GEO superior ■ get court martialed
I like the rule complexity of V2 better, but this part is nice and works with V2 without modification!

What is more fatesque in my opinion that a few skills (I found 2 in the QS) are more then just expertise, like Tough SOB, and Wary. I am not fond of that, but it is nothing inherently wrong with it either. The rules are solid, and, unsurprisingly, more freestlye then V2 and very much more freestyle then V1.
 
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Thanaeon

Mostly simulationist
Validated User
Central is relative to one's taste. Compared to Fate, they are definitely not central. You can even play without them if you are bothered by them. I find them nifty, because they are easy to understand and simple to use. They are simple attributes modifiers.
  1. Tags are something inherent to the character acquired during adventures (-+1 to -+4). Like missing little finger giving -1 ot Dexterity sometimes, amnesia, personality trait. Etc.
  2. Tracks specific mental or physical state (-2 to +2). They are campaign or party specific, like Family, Squad Members, Bravery (I think a Call of Cthulhu game would have Sanity as a track for example). From the adventure: RED SKY CHARTERS : Lifeblood of the company +2/-2; Sweat and tears +1/-1; We’ve got this! 0/0; I’ve had it up to the gills! -1/+1; Screw it! I’m out! -2/+2
And here's the important part (for me): are those things tied to a metagame currency? If someone's missing a finger, will it give its penalty to the character whenever it becomes relevant, or only when metagame currency is applied to make it "real" at that particular instant? That, to me, is the problem I have with Fate and its spiritual kin.
  1. Ties are connection, which have a condition/resonsibility and a punishment for not doing that. Example of one NPC from the adventure: GORSHKOV FAMILY. Must loyally follow orders ■ Executed and dumped in the ocean. On top of my had another one would be GEO Soldier: obey GEO superior ■ get court martialed
This looks interesting on the one hand but overly mechanistic on the other. Take the GEO soldier example; if I'm reading this right, if they obey their superior, they get court martialed, period.

Which makes sense. Except when it doesn't; if they manage to disobey in a way that leaves no traces, say. In that case, it doesn't make sense for the consequence to be triggered. Obviously, even if the rules don't explicitly allow for this kind of application of common sense, the group can always override it or use house rules or something, so it isn't a fatal problem, but just having it there would be something that'd rub me the wrong way, and this kind of mechanistic "if X, then Y, those're the rules" approach to game design has become increasingly fashionable over the last decade or so.
 

MichaelSD

Silver Dragon
Validated User
Only where relevant. Not metagame currency used.

Geo Soldier (my example) has a condition to obey, if not he is court-martialed. I asked the same question on the BP forum: why the condition and responsibility is needed? There is no mechanical reenforcment behind it, and it is quite narrow and stating the "obvious". I think Tie: Geo Soldier in it's own would suffice too. Based on the QS, I am not 100% sure if I unserstood it correctly.
 

Freelancing Roleplayer

Registered User
Validated User
Nice! I'll start saving for the KS now... I never got to play V2 but I love the setting. Everything they changed looks to be for the better, as well.
 

Greg Benage

Registered User
Validated User
And here's the important part (for me): are those things tied to a metagame currency? If someone's missing a finger, will it give its penalty to the character whenever it becomes relevant, or only when metagame currency is applied to make it "real" at that particular instant? That, to me, is the problem I have with Fate and its spiritual kin.
Nah, Jeff and I talked a lot about "dissociated" or metagame mechanics and why we wanted to avoid them for BP. Even Strain is explicitly "associated" and sim-influenced: The task resolution rules assume that we always put the same amount of effort into everything we do, and we all know that isn't true. So Strain allows a character to put extra effort into important tasks, but that extra effort draws-down the character's reserves.
 

Greg Benage

Registered User
Validated User
This looks interesting on the one hand but overly mechanistic on the other. Take the GEO soldier example; if I'm reading this right, if they obey their superior, they get court martialed, period.

Which makes sense. Except when it doesn't; if they manage to disobey in a way that leaves no traces, say. In that case, it doesn't make sense for the consequence to be triggered. Obviously, even if the rules don't explicitly allow for this kind of application of common sense, the group can always override it or use house rules or something, so it isn't a fatal problem, but just having it there would be something that'd rub me the wrong way, and this kind of mechanistic "if X, then Y, those're the rules" approach to game design has become increasingly fashionable over the last decade or so.
Note the closest actual example from the QS:

Maggie has a tie that’s called “warden’s service,” and the connection is an oath of loyalty. Her obligation is that she must act within GEO regulations or risk dismissal or even criminal prosecution.
I'd expect a soldier's tie to be similar: obey orders or risk disciplinary action, up to and including court-martial. As noted, these elements are meant and presented as roleplaying cues rather than weird mechanical straitjackets.
 

Thanaeon

Mostly simulationist
Validated User
Nah, Jeff and I talked a lot about "dissociated" or metagame mechanics and why we wanted to avoid them for BP. Even Strain is explicitly "associated" and sim-influenced: The task resolution rules assume that we always put the same amount of effort into everything we do, and we all know that isn't true. So Strain allows a character to put extra effort into important tasks, but that extra effort draws-down the character's reserves.
Okay, this is very much in line with my own opinions regarding RPG design, then.
 

Darkeus

...is still laughing
Validated User
Well now you have my curiosity. I was also unaware this was getting a new edition!
 

Ghola

Veteran of 100k psychic wars
Validated User
The biggest differences in the system are that there are four attributes, with exception-based rules for extraordinary qualities within those attributes (instead of 12 attributes or whatever in v2) and there is no skill list. Instead, you choose (or create) your origin, background, profession, etc., called "skill sets," and you can do stuff related to them at the designated level of expertise. I find it simultaneously "more realistic" and way less annoying both in play and character creation than any skill list. There's also more of what I guess you'd call narrative support in the rules. I had next to nothing to do with it, but I think Jeff did a great job of taking Synergy and dragging it into the 21st century.
This sounds great to me as I thought v2 was a bit fiddly. Also if the KS doesn't start until 2020 I won't be breaking my New Year's Resolution.

Welcome back!
 
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