• The Infractions Forum is available for public view. Please note that if you have been suspended you will need to open a private/incognito browser window to view it.

Eclipse Phase: More Nuance Later?

Anfelas

Registered User
Validated User
Or it could be the birth of neo-Judaism.

After all, how many times were the jewish peoples massacred by godly decree back in the old testament?
 

M¥$T1C

chippin' in
Validated User
Oh, those people didn't really go away, they just get drowned out. I recall seeing articles from a couple right-wing blogs about how Biden's Catholicism was going to place us on the road to enslavement to the Pope.
As a European I was quite astonished when I first stumbled, somewhere in the American parts of the internet, on the world view in which Catholics are not considered Christians. Every history book I ever encountered (that dealt with such issues) portrays Catholicism as the original Christianity - quite logical considering that it has existed for 2000 years while Protestantism (not regarding its later splintering) is only a few hundred years old. Even within the ecumenical movement Roman Catholicism (more or less) regards itself the "true" church and other Christian groups as misguided brothers at best if not heretics …

Can somebody shine a light on that POV?
 

cliffc999

Registered User
Validated User
To quote a friend of mine:
Your friend is apparently unaware that the game canon has a surviving Jewish population.

Also, your friend is apparently under the belief that Jewish people are allergic to space, given that his entire argument assumes every single Jewish congregation in the Solar System is still on Earth when the Fall arrives. Since that is absolutely absurd as a starting assumption, his long and elaborate rationalization is precisely that; a rationalization. The settlements on Luna and Mars were started up over fifty years before the Fall arrives, and America (the country with the second largest Jewish population, as your friend concedes) was a primary contributor to the original settlements of both places. What, did they all just coincidentally stay home? Is their some historic trend of Jews being unwilling to emigrate to new places that I was unaware of? (sarcasm)

Oh, and which country was one of the primary startups of (God help us) the Jovians again? Shouldn't X percentage of their settlers also be Jewish? What, were they purged? Are they going to make the Jovians really the Nazis now, not just pseudo-Nazis?

The reason some people believe that the Jews can survive almost anything is because if human history contains a record of a more determined bunch of survivors, an ethnic and religious population that has survived more diverse, determined, and prolonged attempts to wipe them from the face of the Earth from literally before the Christian era on up to the present day, we are not aware of what it is. So yeah, saying 'they all died in the Fall' would be odious enough if it was any other ethnic subgroup famous for attracting hate, but when its the Jews? Its not only odious, its farcical.
 
Last edited:

Corum

Registered User
Validated User
As a European I was quite astonished when I first stumbled, somewhere in the American parts of the internet, on the world view in which Catholics are not considered Christians. Every history book I ever encountered (that dealt with such issues) portrays Catholicism as the original Christianity - quite logical considering that it has existed for 2000 years while Protestantism (not regarding its later splintering) is only a few hundred years old. Even within the ecumenical movement Roman Catholicism (more or less) regards itself the "true" church and other Christian groups as misguided brothers at best if not heretics …

Can somebody shine a light on that POV?
This view actually originated in European Protestantism and was carried over into the English colonies. The view softened among the Europeans but not among many American fundamentalists. Anti-Catholicism is still rampant among fundamentalists, those who disagree with Catholic moral teaching, and among WASP nativists. It runs deep in American culture.
 

technoextreme

New member
Banned
As a European I was quite astonished when I first stumbled, somewhere in the American parts of the internet, on the world view in which Catholics are not considered Christians. Every history book I ever encountered (that dealt with such issues) portrays Catholicism as the original Christianity - quite logical considering that it has existed for 2000 years while Protestantism (not regarding its later splintering) is only a few hundred years old. Even within the ecumenical movement Roman Catholicism (more or less) regards itself the "true" church and other Christian groups as misguided brothers at best if not heretics …

Can somebody shine a light on that POV?
Because from a historical standpoint people in the United States have had a history of othering people who don't fit the WASP acronym. That and its the internet. You probably just found a nutty contingent of people in the US.
 

cliffc999

Registered User
Validated User
One of my favorite jokes about my home nation is that 'The United States was originally settled by two categories of people. One, the people who were sick and tired of putting up with Europe's crazy bullshit. Two, the people who Europe was sick and tired of putting up with the crazy bullshit of.'

The sociological effects of this are still being endured 200+ years later. :)
 
Last edited:

Tarrant12

Registered User
Validated User
M¥$T1C said:
As a European I was quite astonished when I first stumbled, somewhere in the American parts of the internet, on the world view in which Catholics are not considered Christians. Every history book I ever encountered (that dealt with such issues) portrays Catholicism as the original Christianity - quite logical considering that it has existed for 2000 years while Protestantism (not regarding its later splintering) is only a few hundred years old. Even within the ecumenical movement Roman Catholicism (more or less) regards itself the "true" church and other Christian groups as misguided brothers at best if not heretics …

Can somebody shine a light on that POV?
My father is a history teacher in a California (more liberal) town just south of San Francisco (Way Liberal) and when they go over the protestant reformation he has had more than one kid over the years say "No that's not the way things happened. Catholics are a perversion/fake/completely different branch of Christianity and we came first". Over the years he's had 6 or 7 parents call him and force the school to excuse them from any history on the reformation because it "goes against our beliefs".

In a nut shell us Americans are odd, odd folk and can enjoy playing editor to real history at times.
 
Last edited:

Susanoo Orbatos

Social Justice Mindflayer
Validated User
It's not really atheist future though. More like "most religions are mystic, philosophical or extremely minor" future. Sufism for example accounts for a greater percentage of humanity than before the Fall.
I suspect the authors had very basic familiarity with some mystic branches of other religions, but experience mostly with the kind of fundamentalist and literal Christianity, which lead to that mistake.
That, or an overzealous attempt to underscore that things are different after the Fall.


I mean it doesn't really feel all that different, Star Trek has been pulling that since Next Generation at the very least. a Christianity that's highly liberal in the modern sense and progressive on technology being agressive in the status of personhood on uplifts and Forks would be in my mind much more "EVERYTHING IS DIFFERENT" than Jovian catholicism.
 

Corum

Registered User
Validated User
My father is a history teacher in a California (more liberal) town just south of San Francisco (Way Liberal) and when they go over the protestant reformation he has had more than one kid over the years say "No that's not the way things happened. Catholics are a perversion/fake/completely different branch of Christianity and we came first". Over the years he's had 6 or 7 parents call him and force the school to excuse them from any history on the reformation because it "goes against our beliefs".

In a nut shell us Americans are odd, odd folk and can enjoy playing editor to real history at times.
We learned it from the English, whose black legends and anti-Catholic propaganda continue to this day.
 

Tarrant12

Registered User
Validated User
That would make sense. Though I always felt that my English friends were just kind of ambivalent towards religion in general even though they labeled them self as religious.
 
Top Bottom