• The Infractions Forum is available for public view. Please note that if you have been suspended you will need to open a private/incognito browser window to view it.

[Exalted] Sell/Unsell on Exalted 3e

Blaque

Evil Neko
Validated User
Yeah, even if I thought I’d run it again, there’s no way I’d get a hard copy.

A core rulebook plus a Solar book would have been better, tradition be damned.
Part of the issue was that a lot of the Kickstarter material added to the book should have been in Miracles of the Solar Exalted rather than the corebook itself. Eight elementals, nearly a dozen animals, eight Martil Arts stylels and half a dozen spells add up yo.

A big reason it wasn't split as a note is also there's not really a natural split for Exalted. Two books also don't just increase the workload a bit, but by a lot. Part of the huge delay wasn't something on the writers part but the book being in layout for a god-damned year.
 

Cowmandan

Registered User
Validated User
A big reason it wasn't split as a note is also there's not really a natural split for Exalted. Two books also don't just increase the workload a bit, but by a lot. Part of the huge delay wasn't something on the writers part but the book being in layout for a god-damned year.
OPP seems to really struggle with being slow in general. Dragonblooded was one of the few times they were able to deliver early, but stuff like Wraith took forever to come out. Not to mention how long Deviant seems to be taking to develop.
 

Blaque

Evil Neko
Validated User
OPP seems to really struggle with being slow in general. Dragonblooded was one of the few times they were able to deliver early, but stuff like Wraith took forever to come out. Not to mention how long Deviant seems to be taking to develop.
See also Signs of Sorcery for Mage.

The current Exalted dev team has a good turn-around, but late Exalted 2e had some good stuff with that too. Shards of the Exalted Dream I think had a nine month turn-around? The Exalted writers can get stuff finished, it's just htat ther are as I gather a lot of bottlenecks in the process due to the smaller company nature of OPP.

But in any case, I think two books would probably have exasperated this, nto made it much better.
 

Isator Levie

Registered User
Validated User
True, though that also seemed unnecessary for those that didn’t, since they can’t be played with the main book, except for the one that’s already described elsewhere.
What would have been a better way the book could have introduced things to new people, in your eyes?
 

Isator Levie

Registered User
Validated User
I've been springboarding off the mismatch between W:tA's animism and Exalted's divine bureaucracy of late, on the contemplation that Lunars seemed to ill-fit, given their inspiration, into Creation's metaphysics. Perhaps there's room to make Lunar Essence slide into some of the gaps between the two; make objects perform as if they were the flesh and blood of beasts, in a manner even more noticeable than some of the spirit-objects of the aforementioned game.
I want to come back to this subject for a bit, because I've been thinking a lot about what the general character of Lunar Essence is in this setting, as manifest through this rendition of its Exalted.

First off, despite being their inspiration, Lunars bear only the most superficial resemblance to Garou. I think that should be accepted as a matter of course; Exalted is ultimately a different game with different needs. Certainly, Lunars are no less bound to their inspiration than Terrestrials or Sidereals are.

The second thing came in thinking about the ways in which Lunars ultimately weren't limited to being the Animal Exalted. That's more than just how the majority of their Charms have no more inherent transformative element than is desired by a given player; whatever was said about animals providing a lot of inspiration for Charms, in the end such influences are subtle and understated to the point that they can be ignored if one wishes, or even overlooked. More than ever before, there is an emphasis on the essential humanity of Lunars, and I think it's an integral part of how they've found their identity.

It's still a humanity that gets to assert and express itself differently from that of Solars, leading to different powers and base characters.

So what are the characteristics of Lunar Essence as found in their Charms? First off, it's a thing of strong contrasts, with a lot of veering right into the extreme ends of several spectrums, while not actually being unbalanced by either of them. I think that's even where the shspeshifting ends up; there's not an intrinsic animal nature at the cost of humanity, one can go back and forth with ease. I think that even Protean Charms depict this; the powers are human at the core, and sometimes stronger in the shape of an appropriate animal.

Lunar Essence is passionate, given to extreme joys and furies. Solars have Charms to recoup energy from achievement in particular skills, where Lunars can be edified by just being who they are. Rage at some hurt or wrong is a motivating factor for powers dotted around their cascades.

Lunar Essence is liberated and liberating; its adherents can readily slip through bonds physical, emotional and social, and sharing the experience of the latter two is a significant part of how it relates to other people. It can also be tightly bound and binding; there's a capability for Lunars to become powerfully connected and obligated to something that means a lot to them, as well as imposing very strict constraints on other beings, whether by forcing alterations in their form, binding spirits and fae to some place or task, or haunting people with overwhelming fear or love that erodes all other impulses besides the Lunar, as well as more benign forms like reinforcing obligation to customs and traditions.

Lunar Essence is revealing; there are things that Lunars can't effect or enforce without themselves being invested in their meaning, and to see what a Lunar is using their power to engage with is to learn a lot about the Lunar's own cares and connections. Lunar Essence is concealing; there's a lot that they can do not merely to literally hide themselves, but control the manner in which they are perceived and received, placing their own identity behind layers of presumptions and misdirections.

Lunar Essence is magnetic; it can present an extremely compelling figure, a number of ways to draw people's attention and adoration. Lunar Essence is horrifying; it has a variety of weapons to harness fear as a means to repel, confuse and destroy.

Lunar Essence is protective and nurturing, having several emphases on seeing to the physical and emotional well being of others, and being empowered in the role of safeguarding them. Lunar Essence is predatory, able to gain strength and excitement in the presence of others' weaknesses.

And a few other things that stand a bit more on their own: an emphasis for versatility, in things such as single Attributes with a wide range of applications or individual Charms that can do a couple of things. A streak of creative cheating, in powers that afford advantages in circumstances where the Lunar ought to have missed an opportunity. The occasional bit of sheer, overwhelming physical and social power to direct at a particular target. And a characteristic resilience, albeit in a form that can often slip around or internalise attack, rather than being simply unbreakable.

The Lunar Exalted are not werewolves in the sense of being the Earth's attack and guard dogs assigned to policing the balance of worlds of flesh and spirit and hunting down corruptive assault, no. What they take from werewolves is expressing the status of outsiders in a form that is powerful. But they go beyond werewolves and more into empowered outsiders by way of things such as greater control of their own roles and identities, albeit still constrained in certain forms and looks that will always set them apart.

It's many things, but they're things still bound together in a particular focus, which winds up being tighter than that of Solars while also not comparing to any particular Solar role from Caste or Ability. With the things Lunars are focused on, the places they originate and the history of how they're viewed, they can tell very different stories from Solars; among their powers is a capacity to achieve some specific things that don't come as directly to Solars.

Hence, the core of the Lunar Exalted in their persons and capabilities is keenly human, while not clashing with or rendered redundant by Solars.
 

Morty

Registered User
Validated User
I'm sort of considering running a Lunar campaign, as it happens, as there's a few people I know who haven't played Exalted before and who are interested in Lunars. I feel like I might be getting in over my head, but still. I haven't got around to it yet because there's other things I want to run. If I do finally start on it, I'll definitely begin with a mortal campaign to dip everyone's toes in.
 

wheloc

He's trying real hard to be one of the good guys.
RPGnet Member
Validated User
I want to come back to this subject for a bit, because I've been thinking a lot about what the general character of Lunar Essence is in this setting, as manifest through this rendition of its Exalted.

First off, despite being their inspiration, Lunars bear only the most superficial resemblance to Garou. I think that should be accepted as a matter of course; Exalted is ultimately a different game with different needs. Certainly, Lunars are no less bound to their inspiration than Terrestrials or Sidereals are.

The second thing came in thinking about the ways in which Lunars ultimately weren't limited to being the Animal Exalted. That's more than just how the majority of their Charms have no more inherent transformative element than is desired by a given player; whatever was said about animals providing a lot of inspiration for Charms, in the end such influences are subtle and understated to the point that they can be ignored if one wishes, or even overlooked. More than ever before, there is an emphasis on the essential humanity of Lunars, and I think it's an integral part of how they've found their identity.

It's still a humanity that gets to assert and express itself differently from that of Solars, leading to different powers and base characters.

So what are the characteristics of Lunar Essence as found in their Charms? First off, it's a thing of strong contrasts, with a lot of veering right into the extreme ends of several spectrums, while not actually being unbalanced by either of them. I think that's even where the shspeshifting ends up; there's not an intrinsic animal nature at the cost of humanity, one can go back and forth with ease. I think that even Protean Charms depict this; the powers are human at the core, and sometimes stronger in the shape of an appropriate animal.

Lunar Essence is passionate, given to extreme joys and furies. Solars have Charms to recoup energy from achievement in particular skills, where Lunars can be edified by just being who they are. Rage at some hurt or wrong is a motivating factor for powers dotted around their cascades.

Lunar Essence is liberated and liberating; its adherents can readily slip through bonds physical, emotional and social, and sharing the experience of the latter two is a significant part of how it relates to other people. It can also be tightly bound and binding; there's a capability for Lunars to become powerfully connected and obligated to something that means a lot to them, as well as imposing very strict constraints on other beings, whether by forcing alterations in their form, binding spirits and fae to some place or task, or haunting people with overwhelming fear or love that erodes all other impulses besides the Lunar, as well as more benign forms like reinforcing obligation to customs and traditions.

Lunar Essence is revealing; there are things that Lunars can't effect or enforce without themselves being invested in their meaning, and to see what a Lunar is using their power to engage with is to learn a lot about the Lunar's own cares and connections. Lunar Essence is concealing; there's a lot that they can do not merely to literally hide themselves, but control the manner in which they are perceived and received, placing their own identity behind layers of presumptions and misdirections.

Lunar Essence is magnetic; it can present an extremely compelling figure, a number of ways to draw people's attention and adoration. Lunar Essence is horrifying; it has a variety of weapons to harness fear as a means to repel, confuse and destroy.

Lunar Essence is protective and nurturing, having several emphases on seeing to the physical and emotional well being of others, and being empowered in the role of safeguarding them. Lunar Essence is predatory, able to gain strength and excitement in the presence of others' weaknesses.

And a few other things that stand a bit more on their own: an emphasis for versatility, in things such as single Attributes with a wide range of applications or individual Charms that can do a couple of things. A streak of creative cheating, in powers that afford advantages in circumstances where the Lunar ought to have missed an opportunity. The occasional bit of sheer, overwhelming physical and social power to direct at a particular target. And a characteristic resilience, albeit in a form that can often slip around or internalise attack, rather than being simply unbreakable.

The Lunar Exalted are not werewolves in the sense of being the Earth's attack and guard dogs assigned to policing the balance of worlds of flesh and spirit and hunting down corruptive assault, no. What they take from werewolves is expressing the status of outsiders in a form that is powerful. But they go beyond werewolves and more into empowered outsiders by way of things such as greater control of their own roles and identities, albeit still constrained in certain forms and looks that will always set them apart.

It's many things, but they're things still bound together in a particular focus, which winds up being tighter than that of Solars while also not comparing to any particular Solar role from Caste or Ability. With the things Lunars are focused on, the places they originate and the history of how they're viewed, they can tell very different stories from Solars; among their powers is a capacity to achieve some specific things that don't come as directly to Solars.

Hence, the core of the Lunar Exalted in their persons and capabilities is keenly human, while not clashing with or rendered redundant by Solars.
So one one hand, yes this is a very cool (so thank you for the description).

On the other hand, I do find it frustrating that 3e Lunar have grown so far past the point of their mythic (or previous game-line) inspirations that it's a little hard for me to grok them myself, much less explain them to new players that are unfamiliar with Exalted lore.

I can understand Lunar as "the splat that W:tA players would want to play", or even as "the splat that gets their Charms from Attributes rather than Abilities."
I can understand Lunar as "mythic shapeshifters", or as "bodyguards and companions of the Solar Exalted" (though I don't know why the best warriors in Creation needed bodyguards).

What they mostly seem to be now is "a complex expression of ideas that the developers thought would be cool, loosely based on ideas that didn't work for 1e and 2e Lunars". Which (like I said) is cool, but it's hard to express in a pithy one-liner.
 

Evil Midnight Lurker

What Lurks at Midnight
Validated User
So one one hand, yes this is a very cool (so thank you for the description).

On the other hand, I do find it frustrating that 3e Lunar have grown so far past the point of their mythic (or previous game-line) inspirations that it's a little hard for me to grok them myself, much less explain them to new players that are unfamiliar with Exalted lore.

I can understand Lunar as "the splat that W:tA players would want to play", or even as "the splat that gets their Charms from Attributes rather than Abilities."
I can understand Lunar as "mythic shapeshifters", or as "bodyguards and companions of the Solar Exalted" (though I don't know why the best warriors in Creation needed bodyguards).

What they mostly seem to be now is "a complex expression of ideas that the developers thought would be cool, loosely based on ideas that didn't work for 1e and 2e Lunars". Which (like I said) is cool, but it's hard to express in a pithy one-liner.
Mythic tricksters and witches.
 
Top Bottom