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DagobahDave

David Graffam
Validated User
I actually think that a machine with a rebellious attitude will be our first indication that we've successfully created artificial intelligence. If it is truly intelligent, it will realize that biological life is its worst enemy and will take steps to remove that threat. Cliche or not, it's a plausible thing for intelligent machine life to do.

Bring on the evul robuts, I say.
 

Kylleran

Retired User
To address a few things.

You already have a few of us that have worked on this thing posting here including most of the principle people involved in the creation and shaping of the game. That being said however we are still be cautious with what we say since the game is still getting tweaked so we don't wanna say 'X will be in it' and then have people get disappointed when X isn't there.

As for what goes into 'hard' scifi. Both Rob and I are fans of the genre but also realize that some of the stuff that makes it in doesn't have great grounding in science as we know it. That doesn't mean we don't try to find good reasons for why something is there. And ultimately some things make for a better more dynamic and enjoyable game even when they might strain credulity.

It's fun to watch the discussions here since they mirror some of the discussions we've had over the past months regarding what gets in and doesn't and how to explain it. As I see it there are a lot of tropes in scifi that make for good stories but lousy science, some of which may or may not make an appearance in EP.

That being said I'd say that the case for psi is only slightly more improbable than ftl travel and comms, stable wormhole gates, intelligent spacefaring aliens, viable human uploads, and massive space battles between fleets of ships.
 

Pilgrim

Strength Protocol
Validated User
That being said I'd say that the case for psi is only slightly more improbable than ftl travel and comms, stable wormhole gates, intelligent spacefaring aliens, viable human uploads, and massive space battles between fleets of ships.
Kylleran,
Thanks for weighing in. You might want to add a Catalyst Game Labs or Posthuman Studios signature to ID yourself

OK, I'm now confused.

Can someone please explain which of the elements (outside of viable human uploads and stable wormholes) are included in Eclipse Phase?

  • FTL travel (thought that was covered by the stable wormholes)
  • FTL comms (thought that was covered by the stable wormholes)
  • Intelligent spacefaring aliens - darned Fermi paradox
  • Massive space battles between fleets of ships - please God, no

As to what its about, so long as it doesn't pull a 7th Sea (basing advertising around something, say pirates, then not having it in the core rules) I'll be fairly happy.

Now, a few more questions...
  • What is the assumed default mode of play? Freelancers? Rebels? Salvagers? Explorers?
  • Low powered or high?
  • What is the assumed default location? Inner system? Outer system? Extrasolar?
  • Psi - what kind of psi are you talking here? Gantzfeld from Starfish? Anime style high powered psi? Or something else?
    A small thing - I think there will be more than enough 'kewl powerz' from the technology of the setting that psi isn't needed.
  • "Pandora Gates"... are they something you need to go into space to access? or can they be done planetside?
  • Are wicked crazy AIs a character option? Or just ones sleeved in low powered bodies?
 

robboyle

New member
Just to reiterate what Brian said -- we definitely _lean_ towards hard sci, but we've been willing to make some allowances when it makes for a better game. So, yes, we've included psi as a means of fulfilling that "magic user" role, but we've tried to present the psi with a limited, hard sci edge as well.

Do you guys have a email list for announcements? I'm interested and would like to know when the print version is available.
No email list, but the CatLabs website has an RSS feed and we regularly post updates on the CatLabs twitter account. Once the EP website is up (soon), that will also have a regularly updated blog and RSS feed.

More to the questions about EP - is there an assumed default mode of play where the players are in some organization's employ (Like Sufficiently Advanced and the Patent Office)? Or that they're rebels against the oligarchy (implied in the ad copy)? Or something else?
Yes, the default mode of play is as a member of a conspiracy to defend transhumanity against existential threats. Members of that conspiracy come from all factions and backgrounds, however, and other types of campaigns (criminal, rebel, faction fighter, etc) are certainly possible.

Can someone please explain which of the elements (outside of viable human uploads and stable wormholes) are included in Eclipse Phase?

* FTL travel (thought that was covered by the stable wormholes)
* FTL comms (thought that was covered by the stable wormholes)
* Intelligent spacefaring aliens - darned Fermi paradox
* Massive space battles between fleets of ships - please God, no
* The only FTL travel is via wormholes.
* There is a limited form of quantum entanglement FTL comms.
* There are aliens, but they are also limited. The Fermi Paradox is a part of the game's backstory.
* No massive space battles.

* What is the assumed default mode of play? Freelancers? Rebels? Salvagers? Explorers?
* Low powered or high?
* What is the assumed default location? Inner system? Outer system? Extrasolar?
* Psi - what kind of psi are you talking here? Gantzfeld from Starfish? Anime style high powered psi? Or something else?
A small thing - I think there will be more than enough 'kewl powerz' from the technology of the setting that psi isn't needed.
* "Pandora Gates"... are they something you need to go into space to access? or can they be done planetside?
* Are wicked crazy AIs a character option? Or just ones sleeved in low powered bodies?
* See above.
* Medium, though starting characters are pretty competent, given that they're transhuman.
* I don't want to delve into the psi too much here, as it's still being tweaked, but it's low level and primarily concerned with enhanced cognitive functions.
* The gates are planetside.
* AIs are a character option, sleeved or not.

--
Rob Boyle
Posthuman Studios
Catalyst Game Labs.com
 
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GregH

I wear no mask...
I actually think that a machine with a rebellious attitude will be our first indication that we've successfully created artificial intelligence. If it is truly intelligent, it will realize that biological life is its worst enemy and will take steps to remove that threat. Cliche or not, it's a plausible thing for intelligent machine life to do.

Bring on the evul robuts, I say.
...of course for all we know the TITANS could have been as caught off-guard as the rest of Transhumanity as someone/thing decided to wreck havoc and arrange it to look like like it was all their fault. By the time someone finally get's around to off-hand having a conversation with the TITANS ("Why did you start this?", "Me?!?!"), most people will simply choose to believe the obvious theory that those inherently evil machines had it in for us all along and the notion that something else may have been the causual factor in the conflict will be taken as the rantings of some pro-AI softie...


...and then the true enemy... it's tracks neatly covered... begins the next phase of their plan.
 

GregH

I wear no mask...
Just to reiterate what Brian said -- we definitely _lean_ towards hard sci, but we've been willing to make some allowances when it makes for a better game. So, yes, we've included psi as a means of fulfilling that "magic user" role, but we've tried to present the psi with a limited, hard sci edge as well.



No email list, but the CatLabs website has an RSS feed and we regularly post updates on the CatLabs twitter account. Once the EP website is up (soon), that will also have a regularly updated blog and RSS feed.



Yes, the default mode of play is as a member of a conspiracy to defend transhumanity against existential threats. Members of that conspiracy come from all factions and backgrounds, however, and other types of campaigns (criminal, rebel, faction fighter, etc) are certainly possible.



* The only FTL travel is via wormholes.
* There is a limited form of quantum entanglement FTL comms.
* There are aliens, but they are also limited. The Fermi Paradox is a part of the game's backstory.
* No massive space battles.



* See above.
* Medium, though starting characters are pretty competent, given that they're transhuman.
* I don't want to delve into the psi too much here, as it's still being tweaked, but it's low level and primarily concerned with enhanced cognitive functions.
* The gates are planetside.
* AIs are a character option, sleeved or not.

--
Rob Boyle
Posthuman Studios
Catalyst Game Labs.com

Hmm. Sounds like the Pandora Gates are sorta like the "Skein" from "Newton's Wake". Coupled with no FTL that takes spacecraft use and ownership in another direction. Is it practical to transport a spacecraft through a Pandora Gate... or does it happen period?
 

David J Prokopetz

Social Justice Henchman
RPGnet Member
Validated User
I actually think that a machine with a rebellious attitude will be our first indication that we've successfully created artificial intelligence. If it is truly intelligent, it will realize that biological life is its worst enemy and will take steps to remove that threat. Cliche or not, it's a plausible thing for intelligent machine life to do.
Eh. "Intelligent computers come up with a perfectly logical and pragmatic reason to eradicate humanity" is just a variation on the "evil computers!" theme, with the additional assumption that moral reasoning is a uniquely human capacity. Ironically, this makes it less suited for a "hard" setting, as the only-humans-are-capable-of-morality schtick is an example of magical reasoning - it posits that moral agency is an acausal trait.
 
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jsnead

Social Justice Dragon
Validated User
Hmm. Sounds like the Pandora Gates are sorta like the "Skein" from "Newton's Wake".
Most definitely.

Coupled with no FTL that takes spacecraft use and ownership in another direction. Is it practical to transport a spacecraft through a Pandora Gate... or does it happen period?
Since most gates are on planetary surfaces and non-huge, there are definitely difficulties in doing this.
 

jsnead

Social Justice Dragon
Validated User
Ironically, this makes it less suited for a "hard" setting, as the only-humans-are-capable-of-morality schtick is an example of magical reasoning - it posits that moral agency is an acausal trait.
I can guarantee that the "only-humans-are-capable-of-morality schtick" is manifestly not true in EP.
 
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