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No love for Nightfall?

dth

Registered User
Validated User
So after waiting for this game for a while, it finally got a release. I was going to wait and ask my SO to pick me up a copy for my birthday but that is weeks away and I wanted it NOW! :D

Thus far, I've played it twice and enjoyed both games.

My first impressions are very favourable. However, I was very much wow'd with my first play of Dominion and subsequent games weren't as much fun.

My thoughts;

1. Not sold on the black backs with Nightfall logo. This is largely irrelevant but it does bug me a little :)

2. Card stock quality so-so. Definitely needs sleeves.

3. The actual card design is superb. It has a very sophisticated look (much better than Thunderstone) and the icons / text are clearly marked / visible.

4. The rules could be better written. But what did I expect from a rulebook that comes with a version number printed actually on the front? :D

5. Gameplay is clever and not just another Dominion clone (though some superficial similiarities with M:TG). Seems to have a lot of possibility / variation in card abilities. My chief issue with Dominion is that while the game is very well engineered, it is so well engineered that the only way to add true variety (and not just variation on a theme) is to introduce new mechanics. This is a flaw. Nightfall appears to have several different mechanical elements that can manipulated to create lots of variety.

6. The box is well engineered / future proof (lots of space for future expansions). Plus it doesn't take up huge amounts of room in your house!

7. Artwork + theme are very very good. I did genuinely feel like it was a supernatural turf war. A huge plus for me, YMMV.

Is it wrong that I want an expansion already? :D

Will post a proper review when I've played enough times to get a real reading on the game.
 

jadarx

What time is it?!
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I have love for Nightfall, although I only played the demo set. Didn't realize the full set was released.

My only concern from playing with the smaller set was that the gameplay seems centered on making other players lose, rather than you win. And if all the other players decide to pile on you, you don't have much of a chance to win. I won the first game I played simply by being forgotten by all the other players.

Does the full set have more cards that allow you to pull wounds out of your deck?
 

dth

Registered User
Validated User
I have love for Nightfall, although I only played the demo set. Didn't realize the full set was released.

My only concern from playing with the smaller set was that the gameplay seems centered on making other players lose, rather than you win.
Odd way of looking at it :) Most games that are directly competitive require you to defeat other people, therefore making them lose ? Oh, I think you mean because Dominion / Settlers etc all follow the Euro model of reaching a goal before anyone else does?

And if all the other players decide to pile on you, you don't have much of a chance to win. I won the first game I played simply by being forgotten by all the other players.
Yes, the group can pretty much ensure that one person is going to lose but that isn't a very effective strategy for ensuring the win :)

Does the full set have more cards that allow you to pull wounds out of your deck?
I noticed there were a few cards which exiled cards from your deck but I am unclear as to how this compares to the preview set.

Can you clarify what is in the preview set?
 

jadarx

What time is it?!
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Odd way of looking at it :) Most games that are directly competitive require you to defeat other people, therefore making them lose ? Oh, I think you mean because Dominion / Settlers etc all follow the Euro model of reaching a goal before anyone else does?

Yes, the group can pretty much ensure that one person is going to lose but that isn't a very effective strategy for ensuring the win :)
Yeah, it is a little odd. I may just be having one of those situations where reversing the common victory condition just messes with some people.

It may be that I'm used to Dominion/Thunderstone. I don't think it's going to be a game problem, but rather a player problem. I can see it being very frustrating to get piled on without any real way to fight back. After all, if you got the vast majority of the wounds, it doesn't matter to you how those remaining few are spread across the other players. You still had no chance.

I'm wondering if this may just be an issue from early play. Of the 3 4-player demo games I played, 2 had one player get 20+ wounds. I won both games with 3-4 wounds. Perhaps with more play, players will realize that piling on doesn't help you win since you're going to just forget one player, who quiet drops a few more wounds on the other player and wins.

I noticed there were a few cards which exiled cards from your deck but I am unclear as to how this compares to the preview set.

Can you clarify what is in the preview set?
It had a smaller card set. I think 25 cards. The only exile cards I remember seeing was Genesis One and some Vampire peep who could exile wounds.
 

Celisasu

The donuts speak to me!
There's also another Vampire that when it's kicker effect activates will exile one of your cards. I thought that sucked until I realized you were meant to do it when you could exile a wound to it. Just be careful when you don't have a wound to exile to it as kickers must be used when the moon that activates them is up. You can't choose not to. I think the game has a lot of potential, hoping to play it with my friends soon. Maybe we'll get a game of it in before we start our D&D session tomorrow night.
 

jadarx

What time is it?!
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There's also another Vampire that when it's kicker effect activates will exile one of your cards. I thought that sucked until I realized you were meant to do it when you could exile a wound to it. Just be careful when you don't have a wound to exile to it as kickers must be used when the moon that activates them is up. You can't choose not to. I think the game has a lot of potential, hoping to play it with my friends soon. Maybe we'll get a game of it in before we start our D&D session tomorrow night.
All the exile cards work like that. Misplay them and you're exiling one of your good cards.

Question: How many players has everyone been playing with? I'm curious how the draft mechanic works with fewer players, particularly 2. A 4 card pool seems a bit small.
 

dth

Registered User
Validated User
All the exile cards work like that. Misplay them and you're exiling one of your good cards.

Question: How many players has everyone been playing with? I'm curious how the draft mechanic works with fewer players, particularly 2. A 4 card pool seems a bit small.
I've played with 2 and 4. 2 player was fun but lacked a couple of elements of the game you get in multiplayer (counting wounds and trying to determine who to hit next). 4 player seemed to be a sweet spot but I've got a game tonight... let's see if I can get a 5th player.

I'm in two minds about the personal archives at the moment. There is potential for them to break the game, if one player has access to an over powered card. But I've not played enough to identify any really powerful cards yet (though there are a couple that seem good).

In my 2 player game, I got mullered by direct damage cards. I wasn't prepared for that :) What is worse is that I had Vulkor (one of the "bodyguard" cards) and didn't start getting him into play until I'd taken a wad of direct damage... I'm quick to learn the rules but always slow to pick up the minutiae of new games. So it goes.
 

jadarx

What time is it?!
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In my 2 player game, I got mullered by direct damage cards. I wasn't prepared for that :) What is worse is that I had Vulkor (one of the "bodyguard" cards) and didn't start getting him into play until I'd taken a wad of direct damage... I'm quick to learn the rules but always slow to pick up the minutiae of new games. So it goes.
I love playing direct damage decks in the two games I got to. Nice and no-nonsense.:D
 

largosama

The Lord of Ulamos
Validated User
I'm writing a formal review for it, but I'll give my quick thoughts on it. I really like the game. I read early reviews of the game saying that it could be a kingmaker style game where people pile on the person with the least wounds, but in games with 4-5 players, it's very hard to keep track of that, so I don't consider it too big of a deal. In the 5 player game that I watched this weekend (teaching my friends how to play), the winner was a guy who was forgotten about. I think it's tough to get into the mentality that 1: You can't eliminate a player in a combat based game and 2: Piling on one player just makes sure that he doesn't win, but doesn't mean that you're in a better position to win.

Drafting your personal archives is pretty important as you'll want to try to draft cards that can chain off of each other. Not that's it absolutely necessary, but it's really helpful.

I really like the chaining mechanic. It keeps every player involved on every turn which is very rare

I also like the fact that there's a positive aspect to having Wounds (drawing more cards). It allows people are getting hit a lot to have some comeback potential.

I do think there's a bit too much minion destruction orders out there. Granted, minions don't last long anyway since they get destroyed right after combat is over, but we've had a few rounds where no player had more than one minion out due to tons of minion destruction being tossed around.

Anyway, those are the basic thoughts. I look forward to playing this game more as it's a lot of fun and I can't wait to get those promos cards and eventual expansions!
 
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