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The Dark Eye RPG - opinions?

Rulandor

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So it is nice to hear that Midgard 5E finally got more streamlined again. Did they change the super low stamina points for beginning characters ?
That was always annoying.
No, stamina points for beginning characters are still very low, but are going to increase more rapidly. The grades are now much smaller steps and easy to climb. On the other hand, even "mid-level" characters now have very high grade numbers (20 or more), which might not be to everybody's taste. I personally like it.

In effect, a beginning character tires easily and will be exhausted long before she is seriously injured. You might call that a quite sensible learning effect.

On the plus side, small "races" (gnomes and halflings) were rather at a disadvantage on stamina points for their whole career, which sucked because stamina points are the bread and butter of adventuring - among other things, they are the "energy" used for spells. Now the little guys have fewer life points, but are equal in stamina to the big ones.
 

Sosthenes

Oiled Greek Wrestler
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I haven't played TDE, but this 'murican quickly fell in love with the setting. I also like how it took all my complaints about point buy character creation and solved them.
As someone who constantly fiddles with GURPS and/or HERO character creation, care to tell a bit more about that, what you dislike in general and how TDE solves it? I assume that the career templates are a big part, right?

I still think that at the end of the character creation process there's a bit too much point-shaving, but at least I'd try to create a 5E char without electronic help, as opposed to 4E. On the other hand, there was a pretty great Java application for that.
 

Ysidro

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As someone who constantly fiddles with GURPS and/or HERO character creation, care to tell a bit more about that, what you dislike in general and how TDE solves it? I assume that the career templates are a big part, right?

I still think that at the end of the character creation process there's a bit too much point-shaving, but at least I'd try to create a 5E char without electronic help, as opposed to 4E. On the other hand, there was a pretty great Java application for that.
Career templates, but those are getting common in a lot of point buy systems. But also the attribute arrays. As well as limits on spends. I hate systems that are so open ended that you can spend all your points in a way that is either ineffective or just plain not fun.
 

videopete

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As someone who constantly fiddles with GURPS and/or HERO character creation, care to tell a bit more about that, what you dislike in general and how TDE solves it? I assume that the career templates are a big part, right?

I still think that at the end of the character creation process there's a bit too much point-shaving, but at least I'd try to create a 5E char without electronic help, as opposed to 4E. On the other hand, there was a pretty great Java application for that.
Career templates, but those are getting common in a lot of point buy systems. But also the attribute arrays. As well as limits on spends. I hate systems that are so open ended that you can spend all your points in a way that is either ineffective or just plain not fun.
They also use a single currency for creation and advancement of characters, so no better choices at character creation vs picking it up later. Except Arcane magic, that and its tradition are only available at creation, gotta say Witches are probably my favorite caster type at least till magic 1 comes out.
 

Bomberg

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No, stamina points for beginning characters are still very low, but are going to increase more rapidly. The grades are now much smaller steps and easy to climb. On the other hand, even "mid-level" characters now have very high grade numbers (20 or more), which might not be to everybody's taste. I personally like it.
Pay tell me, how does this change affect spellcasters? II always felt (M2 and M3) that spellcasters were not so interesting because of the low number of the Ausdauerpunkte and the slow increase of them.
 

Rulandor

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Pay tell me, how does this change affect spellcasters? II always felt (M2 and M3) that spellcasters were not so interesting because of the low number of the Ausdauerpunkte and the slow increase of them.
I couldn't tell you that without a lot of play experience.

All in all, the system always tried - and 5th edition still tries - to keep spellcasters from dominating game especially at higher grades.

Now, the SYSTEM of magic is very, very interesting. Spellcasters are not rulers of the game world (because they are simply no more apt to than are warriors or politicians), but they deal in fascinating stuff. Midgard has an elaborate myth about why magic works the way it does, working with processes, acting forces (Agens) and forces acted upon (Reagens). The system even "explains" how the world is built and works magically, by using a philosophy of 10 Essences, 8 of which are "true elements", the other two the Primal Stuff of Order (Metal) and the Primal Stuff of Chaos (Magan).

Nice thing is, for using spells in the game, you need nothing of that. The books even state that not a single spellcaster tradition in the game world has the true picture, but a workable one. But this magic lore even explains why the undead, spirits, revenants and such are acting and reacting to magic the way they do, even why humanoids, animals and plants react differently. It is a lot of fun.

And last but not least: the magic lore exactly defines the difference between "demonic magic" of mages and witches, the life magic (dweomer) of druids and their ilk, the miracles of priests and shamans and the spell songs of bards. It also explains why these traditions sometimes have spells identical to those of other traditions, but why on the other hand some tradition can do specific things that another cannot. Mages and Sorcerers and Witches cannot heal, not for the life of them, while Priests and Shamans definitely can und Druids and other Dweomer-Casters can in a way slightly different to Priests and Shamans.

Isn't that fascinating?
 

The Last Conformist

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I don't think anyone explained how the three-roll skill resolution in DSA actually works? Do you really roll the equivalent of what would be three separate skill checks in a system like GURPS? Could you speed the process up by rolling all three simultaneously, using different-coloured dice say?
 

The Pat

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I don't think anyone explained how the three-roll skill resolution in DSA actually works? Do you really roll the equivalent of what would be three separate skill checks in a system like GURPS? Could you speed the process up by rolling all three simultaneously, using different-coloured dice say?
This is exactly what you do. In detail:
1. Every skill is linked to 3 attributes
2. You roll 3D20 of different colors, declaring in advance which coler is linked to which attribute (in practice you just use the same color sequence, so "green is first", "blus is second" and "red is third - this way you declare once for all rolls in the game)
3. You try do get below or equal all your respective attribute ratings (which are usually with values between 8 and 15)
4. You can use skill ranks to "buy-off" on rolls where you rolled higher than the attribute
5. If you end up with 0 or positive skill ransk you succeed, with the number of excess skill ranks describing the quality of success

e.g. attributes are 12/13/10 and you have 7 skill ranks. Your roll 3/15/12:
first roll 3 < 12 --> no problem
second roll 15 > 13 --> need to spend 2 skill ranks to balance the high roll
third 12 > 10 --> spend another 2 skill ranks
--> check is passed with 3 skill ranks remaining


Overall not the most elegant/lean system, but after some practice it doesn't take too much time. It has the benfit of being non-linear and creating conststant results.
The main drawback is that it is extremly hard to estaimate you chance of success. (Little test: what is the propabiliy to succeed if you have attributes of 12/11/13 and 7 skill ranks? Is it better or worse than having 13/14/12 and 4 skill ranks?)
 

The Pat

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Of my now 30 years of regular roleplaying I have spend about 50% on playing The Dark Eye (which will total approx. 450 sessions or 1.800 hours ...). We have moved away from the system with the switch from 4the to 5th edition and played since then with a totally different homebrew system.

The strength of TDE/DSA has for us always been the grounded and detailed world and we also enjoyed large parts of the metaplot (which we customized to fit the events of our gaming). The system for us was "okayish"
 

Spaßwolf

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The system even "explains" how the world is built and works magically, by using a philosophy of 10 Essences, 8 of which are "true elements", the other two the Primal Stuff of Order (Metal) and the Primal Stuff of Chaos (Magan).
Wasn't it 6 elements (the classic 4 plus life/wood and death/ice) and the 2 principles of order/metal and chaos/magan? With a multiverse that sorts it's planes by the the number of primary elements. So there's 6 monoelemental planes on one end of the order-chaos axis and one omnielemental plane of absolute chaos on the other end. Midgard itself is from the central plane of earth, air, water, while the elves migrated from the minor chaos plane of earth, air, water and life/wood. Summoners are either elementalists (summoning from worlds with less elements) or demonologist (summoning from worlds with more elements). Some not-japanese mages also summon metal elementals, even tough metal is not even a real element.
 
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