WFRP 2e - Giantslayers & Giants

bottg

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We had a chat on tuesday evening because the Dwarf in the party was considering becoming a Trollslayer. As he is already a good way through veteran he would have almost all of the skills and talents there so could progress to Giantslayer quite quickly. But to get in you must have slain a Giant.

Which got me thinking. I was always under the impression (through 30-odd years of warhammer) that Trollslayers sought out death by fighting trolls, so you became one to seek out trolls to kill.
Similarly, Giantslayers seek death by fighting Giants so once you become one you seek out Giants. So my thinking would be that you cannot move on from troll slayer until you have killed a Troll and on from Giantslayer until you have killed a Demon.

I can easily change the rule, but how have others played it?
 

Tamuz

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You are correct, at least in early editions of the game.

I would allow promotion to giantslayer after killing a troll, and promotion to demonslayer after killing a giant (or monster of equivalent or greater difficulty - I don't think it needs to be specific)
 

Shining Dragon

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I think you’re correct in thinking that the requirement to enter the Giantslayer career should be that the character has slain a Troll, not Giant. Obviously the character has failed at being killed by a Troll and must seek death by something even more challenging such as a Giant.

The 4E Slayer career states this, even though Trappings don’t appear to serve the same purpose as they did in 2E.
 

bottg

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I think you’re correct in thinking that the requirement to enter the Giantslayer career should be that the character has slain a Troll, not Giant. Obviously the character has failed at being killed by a Troll and must seek death by something even more challenging such as a Giant.

The 4E Slayer career states this, even though Trappings don’t appear to serve the same purpose as they did in 2E.
Interesting that 4e does it that way. I think that is how i will play it from now on!
 

JerekKruger

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Yeah I'd change this to require him to have slain a troll. That makes more sense given the lore as I understand it.

... promotion to demonslayer after killing a giant.
Does WFRP2e not have dragonslayers?

To be fair, dragons in Warhammer is on a par with most greater demons (or were when I last played) and certainly more powerful than any lesser demons, so, having slayed a dragon, I don't know that it makes that to seek a demon. I am not really sure what it does make sense to seek however.
 

Mirkady

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(or monster of equivalent or greater difficulty - I don't think it needs to be specific)
I’d agree with this too. The names of different careers reflect the sort of foes that the Slayer seeks out but shouldn’t be read too literally. Gotrek, for what it is worth, kills a greater demon before he encounters a giant...
 

Robin Low

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These titles, Troll-, Giant, and so on, are metaphors, not literal. A Giantslayer is a Trollslayer who has failed to die, despite honestly seeking out, facing and overcoming powerful foes. They've become a noted figure in Dwarf society, albeit a shunned one. If I was GMing, as long as all Advances, Skills and Talents have been taken and there has been at least one notably challenging fight where the Slayer overcame the odds, I'd let her change career. This would probably be a set-piece for the whole group, but with a particular challenge for the Slayer.

If the official rules for any edition require the death of a Troll, Giant, Dragon, or Daemon as a requirement for the career change, then they miss the point. Similarly players of slayers who think GMs should provide fair and balanced challenges for them have also missed the point. If the GM throws a Dragon at the party in the first session, then while the rest of the PCs run away the Trollslayer charges it. If (when) he dies, his Shame is stricken from the record. I'd then give the Trollslayer's player the character's xp for the session to add to his new PC at creation, because that's fair.

Regards,

Robin
 

macd21

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Yeah, I’ve never required a slayer character to seek out a specific creature and kill it before moving on to another career. I’ve never even had a giant or a dragon feature in any of my games.
 

Capeträger

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Realistically speaking, even if the character never officially is called a giantslayer by anyone, at some point experience and training would make him surpass the stats of a troll slayer and go into giant slayer territory, if he doesn't die before. While some careers are actually distinguished by decisions the character makes, the different slayers do the same, just better, so the transistion should just happen.
 

TheHistorian

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IIRC, the requirements flipped between 1E and 2E. It was what you recall, but changed to what you're finding now.
 
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